Words of Wisdom from our experience...
- Thread starter nirbhay Dixit
- Start date
Talking Time-Frames :
One of my friends is a super-positional trader, the buy-and-forget types. Makes good money. I skrewed him out of love on a couple of occassions before i stopped (Not what it sounds like).
Heres the thing, i (intend to) trade swings. So a "death spiral" for me is price coming down 6% to test a support.
A "Death spiral" for him is HIS criteria that i know not much about.
So with the best of intentions if i were to call and tell him "The stocks going down" he interprets it differently, and has on a couple of occassions exited stocks which were to give him good money. His lack of conviction i could irresponsibly say or My lack of understnding his principles and basis of making a trade and irresponsibly doling out advice on another TF.
Lets go down one time frame :
13-08-2010 (Friday) I enter long on an impulse triangulation on ANDHRABANK, i tell this trader friend.
16-08-2010 (Monday, next trading day) : Approx 2 PM he calls to tell me ANDHRABANK is CRASHING, NIFTY is CRASHING, i exit the trade near about its open price (~153) which it just came to test. There was to be a further rise till 165 which i was not a part of.
Best of intentions
CRASHING of a day-trader is an immidiate fall that he can scalp or make money off or a lack of buyers at point X in time. So he did so with the best of intentions, i lost my profits all the way.
The lesson is :
If you swing-trade, keep yr 'good intentions' to yrself pls, positional traders see things very differently, dont mess things up for them. Your TA will not work for him, tho it may be magical for you.
If you scalp / trade intraday, pls refrain fm "saving" someone who trades swing or positional, they see things differently. Your TA will not work for him, tho it may be magical for you.
If you swing or positional trade, i doubt you would even understand how day-traders work (i dont), so nothing to worry about
Each kind of trading is very very specialized, in most cases one cant do what the other does or even see things as the other does, as i said, doctors and engineers.
One of my friends is a super-positional trader, the buy-and-forget types. Makes good money. I skrewed him out of love on a couple of occassions before i stopped (Not what it sounds like).
Heres the thing, i (intend to) trade swings. So a "death spiral" for me is price coming down 6% to test a support.
A "Death spiral" for him is HIS criteria that i know not much about.
So with the best of intentions if i were to call and tell him "The stocks going down" he interprets it differently, and has on a couple of occassions exited stocks which were to give him good money. His lack of conviction i could irresponsibly say or My lack of understnding his principles and basis of making a trade and irresponsibly doling out advice on another TF.
Lets go down one time frame :
13-08-2010 (Friday) I enter long on an impulse triangulation on ANDHRABANK, i tell this trader friend.
16-08-2010 (Monday, next trading day) : Approx 2 PM he calls to tell me ANDHRABANK is CRASHING, NIFTY is CRASHING, i exit the trade near about its open price (~153) which it just came to test. There was to be a further rise till 165 which i was not a part of.
Best of intentions
CRASHING of a day-trader is an immidiate fall that he can scalp or make money off or a lack of buyers at point X in time. So he did so with the best of intentions, i lost my profits all the way.
The lesson is :
If you swing-trade, keep yr 'good intentions' to yrself pls, positional traders see things very differently, dont mess things up for them. Your TA will not work for him, tho it may be magical for you.
If you scalp / trade intraday, pls refrain fm "saving" someone who trades swing or positional, they see things differently. Your TA will not work for him, tho it may be magical for you.
If you swing or positional trade, i doubt you would even understand how day-traders work (i dont), so nothing to worry about
Each kind of trading is very very specialized, in most cases one cant do what the other does or even see things as the other does, as i said, doctors and engineers.
Last edited:
Nirbhay, I'm going to have to take an exception with you along at least 2 lines.
What I'm about to say might come off as hard, but you are coming off as the teacher rather than the student, and I consider myself to be both, so I think we can speak on equal terms.
You mentioned in one of your posts to not daytrade. I need to make a few points:
1. Trading and developing a methodology to trade by is personal. I know of quite a few traders who are very good, but all our methodologies are as diverse as can be. Personally, I hold many of my trades for less than 24 hours and make good profits.
2. I am a very good trader, but I'm not going to take your time in boasting about it. All I'm saying is, just because I am good at what I do does not make someone else wrong at what they do. As an example, I won't go to you and say, "Nirbhay, don't position trade. You're wrong." No! If you are doing well with your approach, that is all that counts.
3. You need to have the proof that daytrading is not profitable before you make such a bold statement that it is not.
You also said something like Nifty cannot be manipulated (Lost the quote, so correct me if I'm wrong.). I guess you mean that there are many times where trading it is out of the question. I don't trade Nifty, as I only trade forex. I forecast Nifty on a weekly basis with a high degree of accuracy. I know nothing about the market, but just what my charts tell me. Please explain that.
In due respect (Please I did not mean to barge in on your thread just to stir things up.), I can tell by your posts you do a lot of reading and have a lot of intelligence. But, don't quote what you see in a book just because it is written in a book. That is only a head knowledge and not a heart knowledge. I think it was Eagle that caught your cut-n-pastes. I was thinking the same thing when I started reading your comments.
Again, "words of wisdom" is what you can enunciate from personal experience. There is no personal experience to say a day trader is wrong.
Also, markets have about 180 degrees of freedom, and anyone of them can set a person free, financially. Markets travel north, south, or east. That would also include northeast and southeast, and the markets travel at varying degrees.
As an ironic twist, I will agree with you that money can be made when the market is in a state of rest (except the weekends). This is because the markets never fully rest. I made 15 pips the other day on the EUR/USD on a scalp. The move hardly created a dent on the screen, as it created a doji on the hourly, which means it started and ended in the same place. There was still enough movement to make some money. (Did I say scalp? Wait! That is shorter than a day trade!)
I wish you well. After being away from this forum for 4 months, I just had to stir the pot up a little.
What I'm about to say might come off as hard, but you are coming off as the teacher rather than the student, and I consider myself to be both, so I think we can speak on equal terms.
You mentioned in one of your posts to not daytrade. I need to make a few points:
1. Trading and developing a methodology to trade by is personal. I know of quite a few traders who are very good, but all our methodologies are as diverse as can be. Personally, I hold many of my trades for less than 24 hours and make good profits.
2. I am a very good trader, but I'm not going to take your time in boasting about it. All I'm saying is, just because I am good at what I do does not make someone else wrong at what they do. As an example, I won't go to you and say, "Nirbhay, don't position trade. You're wrong." No! If you are doing well with your approach, that is all that counts.
3. You need to have the proof that daytrading is not profitable before you make such a bold statement that it is not.
You also said something like Nifty cannot be manipulated (Lost the quote, so correct me if I'm wrong.). I guess you mean that there are many times where trading it is out of the question. I don't trade Nifty, as I only trade forex. I forecast Nifty on a weekly basis with a high degree of accuracy. I know nothing about the market, but just what my charts tell me. Please explain that.
In due respect (Please I did not mean to barge in on your thread just to stir things up.), I can tell by your posts you do a lot of reading and have a lot of intelligence. But, don't quote what you see in a book just because it is written in a book. That is only a head knowledge and not a heart knowledge. I think it was Eagle that caught your cut-n-pastes. I was thinking the same thing when I started reading your comments.
Again, "words of wisdom" is what you can enunciate from personal experience. There is no personal experience to say a day trader is wrong.
Also, markets have about 180 degrees of freedom, and anyone of them can set a person free, financially. Markets travel north, south, or east. That would also include northeast and southeast, and the markets travel at varying degrees.
As an ironic twist, I will agree with you that money can be made when the market is in a state of rest (except the weekends). This is because the markets never fully rest. I made 15 pips the other day on the EUR/USD on a scalp. The move hardly created a dent on the screen, as it created a doji on the hourly, which means it started and ended in the same place. There was still enough movement to make some money. (Did I say scalp? Wait! That is shorter than a day trade!)
I wish you well. After being away from this forum for 4 months, I just had to stir the pot up a little.
Nice to know you are making good money through Day trades. But the idea of this thread is also to share some of our own ideas and certain learning from our trading experience. It could be a market truth. Just because one has learn't these truths hard way don make them wrong..
You will be of a much better help if you could follow your critique with something from your side also. Its not much fun coming back after 4 months and not adding something original.
You will be of a much better help if you could follow your critique with something from your side also. Its not much fun coming back after 4 months and not adding something original.
Nirbhay, I'm not sure I'm following you.
The critique is from my side. It is original. It was also a repudiation of your claim of not daytrading. It was an important addendum to your thread, as it should not be conveyed that daytrading is wrong.
In you saying that someone should not daytrade, in essence, you are saying they are wrong. This is why I repudiated that, because the simple fact is no one trading style is wrong.
Also, what I have is original. Everything I offer is original, which includes my forecasts in my thread.
The critique is from my side. It is original. It was also a repudiation of your claim of not daytrading. It was an important addendum to your thread, as it should not be conveyed that daytrading is wrong.
In you saying that someone should not daytrade, in essence, you are saying they are wrong. This is why I repudiated that, because the simple fact is no one trading style is wrong.
Also, what I have is original. Everything I offer is original, which includes my forecasts in my thread.
Just a random thought..
Dear friends,
Most of us loose money in the market. Although we find it hard to admit but this is true.
How we loose money ?
Of course when trade goes against us, or more appropriately put, when market moves opposite to our view.
Example of a loosing trade.
We have a view market will go up we buy nifty future and market goes down and we loose money. Right?
And as we have been loosing money over the years it means that market tends to move on an average against our view. So why not use our lack of ability to identify the trend of the market to our advantage.
So the big idea could be to trade against our view. So when we have a view that the market will go up in place of buying futures (that we may normally do) sell futures (i.e against our view). Will we make money doing so ???
Lets start a healthy debate on this. I will add my views as the discussion progresses.
Dear friends,
Most of us loose money in the market. Although we find it hard to admit but this is true.
How we loose money ?
Of course when trade goes against us, or more appropriately put, when market moves opposite to our view.
Example of a loosing trade.
We have a view market will go up we buy nifty future and market goes down and we loose money. Right?
And as we have been loosing money over the years it means that market tends to move on an average against our view. So why not use our lack of ability to identify the trend of the market to our advantage.
So the big idea could be to trade against our view. So when we have a view that the market will go up in place of buying futures (that we may normally do) sell futures (i.e against our view). Will we make money doing so ???
Lets start a healthy debate on this. I will add my views as the discussion progresses.
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