Trader's Challenge: Keeping the demons in leash
- Thread starter AceX
- Start date
- Tags journal observation strategy trading trading psychology
U
Plz be assured no body in this Planet can say that he/she has not & is not facing any LOSS in intraday,if he/she claims then be 100 % sure it is a blatant lie.
I am doing each & everyday intraday trading since many years & understand that i am not so dumb.
The Profit ,the payout from broker's a/c is a sum total after accounting for loss.
There is NO impulsive trade.
The Risk has to be visualized in monetary term before entering the trade & how to mitigate that is Absolutely clear beforehand.
No position is to be left Open in the name of God/Allah/Hope but to be Managed.
From where this personal Demon is entering ,those stages are to be encountered at 'Apprentish Level' & well thought out Personalized Trading Method is to be evoloved.
Let me put forward an example,if we have seen how Saint does intraday,he makes good money in Addition,it suits his personality (his demons are neutralized),i Always book 50 % profit & bring Stop to Entry (my demons are nuetralized).
But after we make a comfortable tactics ,it gets under your skin,it becomes your 2nd nature.Never in my Life i would try to emaluate Saint's way nor he emaluate mine.
It is a game of weighing more odds in my favour before putting a trade,after the trade Managing it,thats all,then next trade irrespective of the out come of 1st trade,even a reversal (double Qty stop)is a NEW trade.
I am doing each & everyday intraday trading since many years & understand that i am not so dumb.
The Profit ,the payout from broker's a/c is a sum total after accounting for loss.
There is NO impulsive trade.
The Risk has to be visualized in monetary term before entering the trade & how to mitigate that is Absolutely clear beforehand.
No position is to be left Open in the name of God/Allah/Hope but to be Managed.
From where this personal Demon is entering ,those stages are to be encountered at 'Apprentish Level' & well thought out Personalized Trading Method is to be evoloved.
Let me put forward an example,if we have seen how Saint does intraday,he makes good money in Addition,it suits his personality (his demons are neutralized),i Always book 50 % profit & bring Stop to Entry (my demons are nuetralized).
But after we make a comfortable tactics ,it gets under your skin,it becomes your 2nd nature.Never in my Life i would try to emaluate Saint's way nor he emaluate mine.
It is a game of weighing more odds in my favour before putting a trade,after the trade Managing it,thats all,then next trade irrespective of the out come of 1st trade,even a reversal (double Qty stop)is a NEW trade.
[Apologies for the late reply, was not keeping well]
[No, its not because of my losses
]!
And each time I kept shorting when the positive MACD ticked down, I got thrown out of the trade by my stop. This continued to happen and the scrip continued to make further negative divergences.
[No, its not because of my losses
]!And each time I kept shorting when the positive MACD ticked down, I got thrown out of the trade by my stop. This continued to happen and the scrip continued to make further negative divergences.
I am afraid that MACD may not be useful in volatile, choppy, trading market. That could be useful indicator in trending market. One should consider a leading indicator like RSI, Stochastic kind of thing in such situations. This only my humble opinion for your consideration as I observe, and have been advised to use MACD kind of indicators only trending situations.
Experienced traders kindly comment.
No never, Asishda, Never did I hint at anything like that. Apologies if I was misunderstood.
But, there is no second opinion, that some of the trades, I have made are the textbook material, for the chapter "How Foolish Can Anybody Get"
I have made some of the most harebrained trades, thats what pains me.
I have always felt, that amateurs daydream about profits, professionals monitor their risks.
Trade Management in the sense? Risk mgmt/Position mgmt or Psychology mgmt?
Hmm... food for thought.
I have anyway, made this rule for myself. For now, I am going to trade in the least position size[my focus should be to learn to trade and not to make money] and only once I have a predetermined winning trade %age I will move onto higher sizes.
I am also doing SL mgmt your way, but I still have got to iron up my wrinkles.
But, there is no second opinion, that some of the trades, I have made are the textbook material, for the chapter "How Foolish Can Anybody Get"
I have made some of the most harebrained trades, thats what pains me.
I have always felt, that amateurs daydream about profits, professionals monitor their risks.
Trade Management in the sense? Risk mgmt/Position mgmt or Psychology mgmt?
Hmm... food for thought.
I have anyway, made this rule for myself. For now, I am going to trade in the least position size[my focus should be to learn to trade and not to make money] and only once I have a predetermined winning trade %age I will move onto higher sizes.
I am also doing SL mgmt your way, but I still have got to iron up my wrinkles.
i know a person who always made profits in intraday....
how ?
even he claimed that no one has made consistent profits trading intraday on a consistent basis.....
then what ?
he observed the volms of all traders in the dealing room & told his dealer that he would do what the trader with highest volms would do...
the trader would go long in say REL @ 2000........HE would sell his @ the same rate ,double qty.....
the final tally....
the trder loses 1.5 lacs & the man of my street wins double the amnt (double volms) over peiod of 6 months.........
how ?
even he claimed that no one has made consistent profits trading intraday on a consistent basis.....
then what ?
he observed the volms of all traders in the dealing room & told his dealer that he would do what the trader with highest volms would do...
the trader would go long in say REL @ 2000........HE would sell his @ the same rate ,double qty.....
the final tally....
the trder loses 1.5 lacs & the man of my street wins double the amnt (double volms) over peiod of 6 months.........
I don't know where this extremely stimulating conversation and discussion will lead to but I guess from this post onwards, maybe we will not really deal with nitty gritties of trading psychology because, I found something really interesting about myself today [talk about self-discovery!] So in light of this, I am not really sure, how much, just how much is this thread suited for this topic.
Hence moderators you might wish to relocate this thread[not necessarily but where I dont know] .
I discovered that all the trades where I lost money was due to one foremost reason.
1. I was expecting 'something'. You might see it as a bias, but let me give you an example. Say, in the chart shown below. This is the MINIFTY chart, in hourly.
See the patterns just before and after 16th? And notice the stochastics?
I 'saw' it as a stoch. divergence and coupled with declining MACDhist. I concluded a trend reversal.But the basis of the reasoning is gone when you really consider that the levels on 16th [just before the rally, the blue line] is not a really that well defined a top when compared to the just concluded rally[the red line]. I hope you are getting my point.
To summarise:
Divergence Points : A and B
A: The rally on 15th midday[the red line]
B: The high of 3027 on 16th midday[the blue line]
Indicator: Stochastic
Crime: A bearish bias [never thought I will be doing this?]
Reason: I am trying to hypothesize something which really is not there.
Hope this self-introspection cures me
AceX
The image :
THE IMAGE
Hence moderators you might wish to relocate this thread[not necessarily but where I dont know] .
I discovered that all the trades where I lost money was due to one foremost reason.
1. I was expecting 'something'. You might see it as a bias, but let me give you an example. Say, in the chart shown below. This is the MINIFTY chart, in hourly.
See the patterns just before and after 16th? And notice the stochastics?
I 'saw' it as a stoch. divergence and coupled with declining MACDhist. I concluded a trend reversal.But the basis of the reasoning is gone when you really consider that the levels on 16th [just before the rally, the blue line] is not a really that well defined a top when compared to the just concluded rally[the red line]. I hope you are getting my point.
To summarise:
Divergence Points : A and B
A: The rally on 15th midday[the red line]
B: The high of 3027 on 16th midday[the blue line]
Indicator: Stochastic
Crime: A bearish bias [never thought I will be doing this?]
Reason: I am trying to hypothesize something which really is not there.
Hope this self-introspection cures me
AceX
The image :
THE IMAGE
Last edited:
This thread can be seen as a trader's diary for me, highlighting my problems, questions, doubts, observations, conclusions and lessons.
This is so that, I am able to look back and realize my pitfalls and progress.
This is also for the seniors over here, to look and show where I am going wrong. Last but not the least its also for the wonderful people over here, who will discover the challenge of trading and defeat their demons, perhaps by relating with my issues...
A diary is as private and sacred a thing as your married life. And naturally opening up a diary for public scrutiny and attention is tantamount to inviting people to observe you while you are in bed [okay, not exactly but you get the point].
So, my purpose will only be served if, my faults are highlighted [by the seniors over here] and the people who are yet to discover 'themselves' start their own introspective thought process.
This is so that, I am able to look back and realize my pitfalls and progress.
This is also for the seniors over here, to look and show where I am going wrong. Last but not the least its also for the wonderful people over here, who will discover the challenge of trading and defeat their demons, perhaps by relating with my issues...
A diary is as private and sacred a thing as your married life. And naturally opening up a diary for public scrutiny and attention is tantamount to inviting people to observe you while you are in bed [okay, not exactly but you get the point].
So, my purpose will only be served if, my faults are highlighted [by the seniors over here] and the people who are yet to discover 'themselves' start their own introspective thought process.
17th December 2008,
For the past few days, I was bearish on NIFTY. The reason for this was some very clear cut, divergences in NIFTY-hourly.
Yet, the bearishness didnt come out quite strong.
Why? Whats the reason?
Isnt trading on divergence a low risk setup?
Yet, today the divergence has paid off. The only thing I can say it was a strong divergence as even stochastics confirmed it. Other than that, a lot of dojis formed in the 10 minutely chart showing indecision.
So any way to differentiate between false divergences?
How do you handle it?
Tighten your stop losses if you are on the opposite side? Or exit altogether? Or will you go with the divergence every time you see it?
----------------------------------------------------------
Apart from these technical things, certain pointers for and of my psychological makeup.
1. I do not trade in the first hour of the market, however lucrative it is.
2. Through previous backtesting, I have understood that trading with a lesser frequency helps a lot.
3. The point 2 means, the capability to discern between counter trend and trend trading and the ability to choose the latter. Yet be mindful of the change in trend.It has helped me.
4. The occassions which has given me good execution was invariably when I played out patiently. Mind you, it not about ignoring SLs, but jumping the gun when movement is not exciting, (which I had been doing in all my losing trades)!
AceX
17th Dec,08
For the past few days, I was bearish on NIFTY. The reason for this was some very clear cut, divergences in NIFTY-hourly.
Yet, the bearishness didnt come out quite strong.
Why? Whats the reason?
Isnt trading on divergence a low risk setup?
Yet, today the divergence has paid off. The only thing I can say it was a strong divergence as even stochastics confirmed it. Other than that, a lot of dojis formed in the 10 minutely chart showing indecision.
So any way to differentiate between false divergences?
How do you handle it?
Tighten your stop losses if you are on the opposite side? Or exit altogether? Or will you go with the divergence every time you see it?
----------------------------------------------------------
Apart from these technical things, certain pointers for and of my psychological makeup.
1. I do not trade in the first hour of the market, however lucrative it is.
2. Through previous backtesting, I have understood that trading with a lesser frequency helps a lot.
3. The point 2 means, the capability to discern between counter trend and trend trading and the ability to choose the latter. Yet be mindful of the change in trend.It has helped me.
4. The occassions which has given me good execution was invariably when I played out patiently. Mind you, it not about ignoring SLs, but jumping the gun when movement is not exciting, (which I had been doing in all my losing trades)!
AceX
17th Dec,08
Last edited:
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