Thoughts on Day/Swing Trading

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avad

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Thanks ST_da.
2 more questions...
Would the pivot break of cipla on 30min suggest a trend change?
And do you think i should have taken the short in dlf i have marked by the red rectangle?



I got confused between the 30-5min method shown by you at the very begining of the thread and the method with 21sma.
And hence i combined them.
 
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By the way i have selected some stocks for tomorrow based on the criteria i mentioned.

BHEL---FOR LONGS
RENUKA---FOR SHORTS
LT---FOR LONGS
HDFC---FOR LONGS
JPASSO--FOR LONGS
STER---FOR LONGS

!-21sma slope is good.
2.visually in uptrend(downtrend begun for renuka)
It would be great if seniors could see the charts and comment as it would be a waste of space is i post the charts here simply for confirmation.

Also i didnot select stocks which 21 sma was intersecting with bars
like---
Tatamotors
tcs
My comments as under :

BHEL.....It has probably topped out..
Renuka.....No charts so cannot comment
LT ...good choice ...but 1365 is a resistance....if it clears that then good fot long trade
HDFC ....Good choice
JP Associates ...Good choice
Sterlite....hmmm not impressed

Smart_trade
 
Thanks ST_da.
2 more questions...
Would the pivot break of cipla on 30min suggest a trend change?
And do you think i should have taken the short in dlf i have marked by the red rectangle?



I got confused between the 30-5min method shown by you at the very begining of the thread and the method with 21sma.
And hence i combined them.
Yes CIPLA in possible downtrend now.

Short in DLF the correct place was those 5-6 bars sideways movement just above the red rectangle marked by you.

Smart_trade
 

avad

Well-Known Member
rENUKA---




looked at bhel on daily. Touched a downtrendline. IS this the reason of why it is bad?



Regarding ster why is it not a good choice?

Thanks
 
BHEL in my view will go sideways to down before it clears today's top.

Sterlite bit sluggish and has resistance in 112.5 -113.

Renuka ....looks good for short....

Smart_trade
 
ST, when a scrip has been trading for a long time near its ATP, there comes a time when it tips over to one side. Is there any way one can predict that ?
Timepass,

When market trades near its VWAP for a long time means the market is in sideways phase. If the pice and VWAP have come down from the top and now going sideways, the chances are we are going to see the breakdown soon so position yourself for that breakdown......mirror image for breakouts....meaning market and VWAP both have come up from the bottom and now going sideways, expect a upwards breakout. But I use this tool for the end game only as there are many more effective techniques to judge the direction of the market. And by the time we come to end of the day most of the time we are positioned in direction of the final crash/pull .

Smart_trade
What is the OTOH scenario for this ? I mean that if the price stays near the VWAP and the VWAP continues moving in one direction, can one expect an explosive breakout/breakdown in the same direction ? Assuming that the momentum is strong enough to push the VWAP up/down continuously.
 
What is the OTOH scenario for this ? I mean that if the price stays near the VWAP and the VWAP continues moving in one direction, can one expect an explosive breakout/breakdown in the same direction ? Assuming that the momentum is strong enough to push the VWAP up/down continuously.
If price stays near the VWAP and the VWAP continues moving in one direction,that means no big move in the market yet. Small move with up/downwards bias...but it does not squeeze the participants on the other side of the trade and can expect a explosive move only when the price and VWAP diverges big in the end....else no big move expected.

Smart_trade
 

avad

Well-Known Member
St_da only cipla gave good move today. took profits just now.

All others opened in gap. Was confused if downtrend had begun or not. How to tackle the gap problem?

Thanks
 

manojkch

Well-Known Member

NIFTY Fut 30 min chart



SBI 30 min chart


I am posting 2 charts to illustrate the concept, the first chart is Nifty Fut 30 min chart and the second chart is State Bank cash 30 min chart.

The first thing which we want when trading large positions is that the market should quickly go in the direction of our trade. We would not like to take large position and see that market does nothing for next 1-2 hours or worst, goes against us.....no one likes it psychologically. So the first principle is trade in the strong trend, uptrend or downtrend....but avoid meandering sideways trends....just stay out of sideways......

Many will wonder why I am showing 30 min charts in daytrading examples. Small timeframes such as 3 min or 5 min give noise sometime....larger timeframes of 30/20 or 15 min are much more stable.....I am taking 30 min for illustration.

The next area is how do we define strong up/down trend....there are many ways....some of them are listed below :

1) An uptrend on daily timeframe, and some sideways movement and a breakout/breakdown from this sideways zone on daily timeframe.....this analysis is required to be done the earlier evening for shortlisting trading candidates next day morning.

2) Market trading above important level/pivot...

3) Market trading above the previous day's high or previous days lows.

4) Market trading above 21 SMA on 30 minand the gradient of 21 SMA is steep...( dont trade when the gradient is flat and market is going up/down of 21 SMA )

5) Market trading above Blue TDST for long side trades and trading below Red TDST for short side trades.

The above list can be expanded based on each trader's favourite trend detection techniques.

Now we come to actual position sizing. Suppose we are in uptrend, we locate a bar as under :

1) a small inside bar ....we go long over the high of this bar and our stops are just below the low.....

2) A small range doji ...signifying a pause in the ongoing trend....

3) a small bar which is of different colour than the main trend...so for long trades we will identify small red bar...long above the high of the red bar and stop below the low.

So here the thought is we are trading in the direction of the trend, strong trend, small pause in the main trend and the trend resumes and we get into the trade....the small bar enables us to take large positions with very low risk...tight stops and we will get atleasr 65 % and above success rate.

The chart shows few long trades on Nifty Fut and few short trades on SBI ( cash ) for those who trade futures or cash markets.if our trading capital is say Rs 5 Lacs....we risk 1 % so we rish Rs 5000 on a trade....if we get a NF trade with 12 points stops we go for 400 NF position.and we sell 1/3 at 2R or 24 points profits, 1/3 at 3 R or 36 points profits and 1/3 at 4R or 48 points profits. We can bring our stops to our entry point when the market moves 1 R or 12 points in our favour.......the last lot can be put on the trailing stops instead or 4R .....

We can even trade a 5-6 stocks group on this ...each time trading 0.25 % risk....so our total risk on all positions is never above 1.25 -1.5 % of our capital and we diversify our risk to some degree...so on some days NF is in sideways but Tata Motors or SBI is moving and we get trades in those counters....

Now we come to the maths.....assuming very conservative 40 trades in a month, and 50 % success rate....and average 2.5 R profits....we loose on 20 trades so we loose 20 % gross and we make 2.5 R on 20 trades so we make 50 % ...that still leaves us 30 % per month......even discounting this and we make 50 % of this ie 15 % per month still a very good return with risk never exceeding 1-1.25 of our capital.

The above are the trading ideas, everyone has to use these ideas in whatever methods he/she is trading......but it just opens our views that large returns with small controlled risk is possible . I have seen some traders making huge profits of say 4 R to 8 R on each trade on methods based on this concept and their profits are beyond the figures given above ( let me also clarify that I am much below these achievements ) ....but small steps...let us start walking in that direction ....

Smart_trade
Thanks a lot.. !! ST Sir
 
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