Trading for brokerage.

[anuragmunjal]

Just for you Ethan Hunt. Consider I have an account XYZ with a certain broker. I enter into an agreement with the broker that he shall share with me a certain % of the brokerage generated by my trading in XYZ account. So in this case I shall trade for generating brokerage and not for profit. Normally if you generate profit in capital markets you have to pay capital gains tax (30% short term and 10% long term). In this case however I have to pay just 10% tax (TDS) on my income. Besides I am assured of money wether my trades go in profit/loss as I shall trade only for generating turnover(brokerage). Since I shall be aiming for breakeven I can close out trades early and put in multiple trades in a session. I hope this makes it amply clear.

Not very clear, I am afraid my friend..
scenario 1. I gain in the mkt., and off course get the brokerage refund, I have to pay tax acc. to my tax slab in both the transactions.
scenario 2. I loose in the mkt. but I gain in the brokerage refund...
my speculative loss does not get adjusted with my profit (brokerage), I would still have to pay 10% tds and furthar applicable tax (as per my slab)..

regards

 

[Creep]

Just for you Ethan Hunt. Consider I have an account XYZ with a certain broker. I enter into an agreement with the broker that he shall share with me a certain % of the brokerage generated by my trading in XYZ account. So in this case I shall trade for generating brokerage and not for profit. Normally if you generate profit in capital markets you have to pay capital gains tax (30% short term and 10% long term). In this case however I have to pay just 10% tax (TDS) on my income. Besides I am assured of money wether my trades go in profit/loss as I shall trade only for generating turnover(brokerage). Since I shall be aiming for breakeven I can close out trades early and put in multiple trades in a session. I hope this makes it amply clear.

:rofl::rofl::rofl:

Can it get more ridiculous than this.. I understand you looking for a good deal for trading, as in low brokerage.. But what you have mentioned is so ridiculously stupid, puts it amongst some of the most stupid things you can do in the market..

Another stupid thing I read about on this forum.. You buy nifty futures this month, if you go wrong, instead of selling what you hold, you sell the next month future, now it is supposed to become some hedge trading.. And then assume that you can exit both of them, such a way you won't lose.. If you could do this, you wouldn't have gone wrong in the first time.. Now you end up paying taxes twice, brokerage twice, take a risk on the spread and take more risk when you exit the positions..

"So in this case I shall trade for generating brokerage and not for profit"... :rofl::rofl:

How the hell do you generate brokerage without making a profit?? You will become one of those cows trading for the govt and the broker and the exchange, making them all STT, Turnover charges and brokerage.. oh i forgot, you will get back some brokerage.. ..

You pay taxes only if you make profits while trading(Which doesn't look like you would), but your tds would be deducted no matter you make a profit or a loss in trading..

Dude, don't be stupid, if you get a good deal, have your brokerage reduced and try to make some money trading..

 

[drvinod_k]

:rofl::rofl::rofl:

Can it get more ridiculous than this.. I understand you looking for a good deal for trading, as in low brokerage.. But what you have mentioned is so ridiculously stupid, puts it amongst some of the most stupid things you can do in the market..

Another stupid thing I read about on this forum.. You buy nifty futures this month, if you go wrong, instead of selling what you hold, you sell the next month future, now it is supposed to become some hedge trading.. And then assume that you can exit both of them, such a way you won't lose.. If you could do this, you wouldn't have gone wrong in the first time.. Now you end up paying taxes twice, brokerage twice, take a risk on the spread and take more risk when you exit the positions..

"So in this case I shall trade for generating brokerage and not for profit"... :rofl::rofl:

How the hell do you generate brokerage without making a profit?? You will become one of those cows trading for the govt and the broker and the exchange, making them all STT, Turnover charges and brokerage.. oh i forgot, you will get back some brokerage.. ..

You pay taxes only if you make profits while trading(Which doesn't look like you would), but your tds would be deducted no matter you make a profit or a loss in trading..

Dude, don't be stupid, if you get a good deal, have your brokerage reduced and try to make some money trading..

Hi Creep,
You can keep your ridiculous appraisal of the situation to yourself. I am extremely sorry that inspite of stating everything so clearly you do not seem to comprehend that this is a safe and profitable venture. So be it. When I say I shall trade for breakeven is it not assumed that it shall cover all the taxes/charges including brokerage for that trade. My aim would be to remain on (no profit no loss or on a very thin profit) margin for the day after deducting everthing. Say I am being charged brokerage of Rs 1000 per crore of turnover and my breakeven comes to Rs 2240 (brokergae + transaction charges) per crore of turnover. I shall aim to keep the transactions close to this figure. At a turnover of 5 Cr per session the brokerage generated would be Rs 5000. I shall be entitled for a 75% of that Rs 5000 brokerage generated. I shall be paying TDS only on this 75% that I will garner. In the above scenario I do not care where the market heads. I shall be happy generating my income. I cannot explain beyond this. If it still confounds anybodys intelligence then it's time for a serious IQ check.

 

[drvinod_k]

Not very clear, I am afraid my friend..
scenario 1. I gain in the mkt., and off course get the brokerage refund, I have to pay tax acc. to my tax slab in both the transactions.
scenario 2. I loose in the mkt. but I gain in the brokerage refund...
my speculative loss does not get adjusted with my profit (brokerage), I would still have to pay 10% tds and furthar applicable tax (as per my slab)..

regards

.


Dude I am trading for BREAKEVEN. No doubt I will pay for brokerage and transaction charges per trade as everyone does but my aim is not to gain. It is to breakeven after (brokerage + transaction charges). I do not have to pay capital gains on breakeven. Even if it is a fractional profit the tax would be minimal. All I would be paying is the TDS on my share of the brokerage generated. This is my view of making money from the markets and I do not insist that people submit to my view but it has it's own positives. Besides honestly how many people really make money from the markets.

 

[Venkatesh1985]

Its definetely a stupid thing .it shows that u relatevely new to the market and comes with the dream .i ll explain how

1.see now u buy some thing and sell to breakeven .u only have to pay the brokarage not someone the broker may be give 75 % of the brokerage return to u but its not his money ,its ur money my friend say ur giving 100 rs to him and getting back 75rs from him.

2. you can say i calculate the breakeven after including brokarage ,tax ,blab blab blab.for that you shd sell atleast 0.15 % more than u bought .are viceversa for short .its less than 40 % chance u get that .

you can think urself innovative thinking and new idea but use my advice dont do that .if u trade in real market i ll bet u lose 40 % capital with in one month.

usually i wont reply to any thread but since u need advice i did



Regards,
Venkatesh

 

[drvinod_k]

Its definetely a stupid thing .it shows that u relatevely new to the market and comes with the dream .i ll explain how

1.see now u buy some thing and sell to breakeven .u only have to pay the brokarage not someone the broker may be give 75 % of the brokerage return to u but its not his money ,its ur money my friend say ur giving 100 rs to him and getting back 75rs from him.

2. you can say i calculate the breakeven after including brokarage ,tax ,blab blab blab.for that you shd sell atleast 0.15 % more than u bought .are viceversa for short .its less than 40 % chance u get that .

you can think urself innovative thinking and new idea but use my advice dont do that .if u trade in real market i ll bet u lose 40 % capital with in one month.

usually i wont reply to any thread but since u need advice i did



Regards,
Venkatesh

Wow Venkatesh thanks for the concern. As for the advice I really do not need it. I do not understand how people are unable to look at the bigger picture. And for your information I am definitely not a newcomer infact I bet I have seen the markets more than you. My perception of the market and the opportunities it offers is different and I stand by it.

 

[sumosanammain]

Wow Venkatesh thanks for the concern. As for the advice I really do not need it. I do not understand how people are unable to look at the bigger picture. And for your information I am definitely not a newcomer infact I bet I have seen the markets more than you. My perception of the market and the opportunities it offers is different and I stand by it.

Go for the Free Flow performance kit along with the initial purchase itself. Getting it factory fitted makes a world of difference.

Didnt get my point?

Arre baba, am talking about the Ferrari that you will purchase in a few months with this jhakaas strategy.

And yes, though it may be personal preference, I would say red looks best.

Go for those after market alloys too. A few 100 crs worth of brokerage more, but heck at 12.5 lakhs, they are a steal.

Do put up your ownership experience at the biggest car enthusiast forum at team-bhp.com/forum

 

[GTji]

Maybe I have missed something or do not understand, but why don't you just open an account with RKSV and pay fixed brokerage of Rs. 1947 +taxes and play your breakeven strategy according to your 0.01% brokerage and earn much more than with your other broker. Way I see it you will be earning Rs. 3750/- per day with your broker but with RKSV you will be earning approximately Rs. 4900/- per day.

 

[drvinod_k]

Maybe I have missed something or do not understand, but why don't you just open an account with RKSV and pay fixed brokerage of Rs. 1947 +taxes and play your breakeven strategy according to your 0.01% brokerage and earn much more than with your other broker. Way I see it you will be earning Rs. 3750/- per day with your broker but with RKSV you will be earning approximately Rs. 4900/- per day.

Hi GTji,
RKSV is a great idea. But still trading with RKSV or with even zero brokerge does not ensure one will make money always and besides they do not offer currencies and commodities as of now. A 5cr turnover daily with a degree of control and safety needs more market hours. I appreciate your view but the way I see it I want my trading to be mechanical which will get finer and bigger with time. I regularly clock more than 2cr/segment/day and I do trade with RKSV also but not at full throttle. Another very important thing is that I will be saving about 20% on taxes as I shall be paying only TDS at 10% on my income.

 

[drvinod_k]

Go for the Free Flow performance kit along with the initial purchase itself. Getting it factory fitted makes a world of difference.

Didnt get my point?

Arre baba, am talking about the Ferrari that you will purchase in a few months with this jhakaas strategy.

And yes, though it may be personal preference, I would say red looks best.

Go for those after market alloys too. A few 100 crs worth of brokerage more, but heck at 12.5 lakhs, they are a steal.

Do put up your ownership experience at the biggest car enthusiast forum at team-bhp.com/forum

After you boss cause the way you have put it, it seems you have made a fleet of RR & Ferraris from the market. Nice way to take a potshot. Would have appreciated a fair and constructive criticism though.