Trade Learner
- Thread starter oilman5
- Start date
so what we learned so far?
trading is an intellectual persuit with greed driven mechanism,not suitable for all.
..........honesty zeal to learn,stoicism........be in present,visualisation......action,cool nerve.
....................
bma........broad market analysis........long drawn interrelated idea
concept of fad..........sense of smelling danger.
........................
after this comes ta........to know how other trader shall behave+price confirmation concept.
...............
next come data +software...........synchronisation........signal development /backtesting
............implementation
after that polishing what works for u and unlearning all other things.last thing is very difficult.....indians have tendency of garbage in..........though cv relentlessly suggests to check utility first and sharpen own tool.
btw...........nowadays forex concept , from viratech data all currency pair and chart study of world index.............suggest..........money is moving out from which country and entering where.
trading is an intellectual persuit with greed driven mechanism,not suitable for all.
..........honesty zeal to learn,stoicism........be in present,visualisation......action,cool nerve.
....................
bma........broad market analysis........long drawn interrelated idea
concept of fad..........sense of smelling danger.
........................
after this comes ta........to know how other trader shall behave+price confirmation concept.
...............
next come data +software...........synchronisation........signal development /backtesting
............implementation
after that polishing what works for u and unlearning all other things.last thing is very difficult.....indians have tendency of garbage in..........though cv relentlessly suggests to check utility first and sharpen own tool.
btw...........nowadays forex concept , from viratech data all currency pair and chart study of world index.............suggest..........money is moving out from which country and entering where.
Hope now all have a fair idea about the capital mkt & the Risk involved.
intraday........n any chart in one axis is Time,hence if now we compress the charts say from weekly figs to monthly or even to yrly,we will find a clear Trend or a bias to (+)ve or (-)ve.
If that be so then WHY we expand the time frame to intraday so the volatility is more or noise is more.
I am RISKING more ,for what gains ,brokerage,margin,thrill,working from home.
Before indulging in this More Risky aspect ,plz ask what do i gain.
And on what LOGIC this seems very easier task.
........................
Day trading is to have complete control on your every emotion & 1 slip = 1 or more loss & remember few good trades are always what lures people to day-trade & that's when trouble starts, then they dont give up even in losses & its a battle of ego.
.................Nobody can disagree that this is Risky,if so then the Outcome is UNCERTAIN.
What is the PROBABILITY of the outcome.So TEST on past incedents to find out.
How do we know that all those past performances where not RANDOM.
Was Big Bang a Random ,a evolutionary ? a scientific process ? Can those be measured to find out or based on BELIEF ? What should we do ?
Gosh i thought day-trading was an easier job ."Shrewd, Sharp, Silent" are only few traits one needed to experiment for trading, just my obeservation though.
I want to learn as much as I can and keep learning in future at the same time start very small and make it big later.
I am willing to risk a small amount of my hard earned money for it
.............. Capital Mkt is a place where people always trade with "Calculated Risk".
There are people who MAY not know the extent of this Risk & trade profitably upto some time & there may be people who knows & trade un-profitably.
Before plunging 1 should know.Even the Risk Appetite varies from people to people
.............1. use a certain limit for day trading (as of now its 10-20k will increase gradually to 40k no more)
2. enter every trade with stoploss. thus limiting my losses
3. as gain occurs increase stoploss to seal it.
4. each day transfer my gain to account and start with same amount of money. enter only known scripts and control emotions. If i lost a good entry point, will wait for later time ..............................Is it necessary that you HAVE to day-trade ? Plz trade based on EoD data .Many a people term it as Swing Trading.
......consider myself amongst the lowest grader here..."
I was at that catogory only,just been promoted to next category recently.
"By swing trading due u mean buying at EOD and sell tomorrow morning or 2-3 day later at around 5% gain or less..... ???"
With 3-5% Gain (after adjusting brokerages) can be next day or few days until Stop Loss Hit.
............................a gem from asish.
Precaution? Lots my friend (as Saint would say). Well for some unfriendly talk.
You think? that means you DONT KNOW. What makes you think?
Stoploss limiting losses? How much? And how accurately?
Transfer gains? Great! And as loss occurs? where do you replenish it from?
How would you control emotions? And how do you know that YOU WOULD control emotions?
........................UNDERSTAND THE DEPTH IN QUESTIONING!!!Imagine somebody thinking that F&O means High Leverage hence my Wins can give me double/triple returns on Equity !! are we aware about the Probability part.
We all trade in F&O ,but where Risk is visible & manageable,No room for wish full thinking,few Winning trades under my belt & i become the Black Belt .
intraday........n any chart in one axis is Time,hence if now we compress the charts say from weekly figs to monthly or even to yrly,we will find a clear Trend or a bias to (+)ve or (-)ve.
If that be so then WHY we expand the time frame to intraday so the volatility is more or noise is more.
I am RISKING more ,for what gains ,brokerage,margin,thrill,working from home.
Before indulging in this More Risky aspect ,plz ask what do i gain.
And on what LOGIC this seems very easier task.
........................
Day trading is to have complete control on your every emotion & 1 slip = 1 or more loss & remember few good trades are always what lures people to day-trade & that's when trouble starts, then they dont give up even in losses & its a battle of ego.
.................Nobody can disagree that this is Risky,if so then the Outcome is UNCERTAIN.
What is the PROBABILITY of the outcome.So TEST on past incedents to find out.
How do we know that all those past performances where not RANDOM.
Was Big Bang a Random ,a evolutionary ? a scientific process ? Can those be measured to find out or based on BELIEF ? What should we do ?
Gosh i thought day-trading was an easier job ."Shrewd, Sharp, Silent" are only few traits one needed to experiment for trading, just my obeservation though.
I want to learn as much as I can and keep learning in future at the same time start very small and make it big later.
I am willing to risk a small amount of my hard earned money for it
.............. Capital Mkt is a place where people always trade with "Calculated Risk".
There are people who MAY not know the extent of this Risk & trade profitably upto some time & there may be people who knows & trade un-profitably.
Before plunging 1 should know.Even the Risk Appetite varies from people to people
.............1. use a certain limit for day trading (as of now its 10-20k will increase gradually to 40k no more)
2. enter every trade with stoploss. thus limiting my losses
3. as gain occurs increase stoploss to seal it.
4. each day transfer my gain to account and start with same amount of money. enter only known scripts and control emotions. If i lost a good entry point, will wait for later time ..............................Is it necessary that you HAVE to day-trade ? Plz trade based on EoD data .Many a people term it as Swing Trading.
......consider myself amongst the lowest grader here..."
I was at that catogory only,just been promoted to next category recently.
"By swing trading due u mean buying at EOD and sell tomorrow morning or 2-3 day later at around 5% gain or less..... ???"
With 3-5% Gain (after adjusting brokerages) can be next day or few days until Stop Loss Hit.
............................a gem from asish.
Precaution? Lots my friend (as Saint would say). Well for some unfriendly talk.
You think? that means you DONT KNOW. What makes you think?
Stoploss limiting losses? How much? And how accurately?
Transfer gains? Great! And as loss occurs? where do you replenish it from?
How would you control emotions? And how do you know that YOU WOULD control emotions?
........................UNDERSTAND THE DEPTH IN QUESTIONING!!!Imagine somebody thinking that F&O means High Leverage hence my Wins can give me double/triple returns on Equity !! are we aware about the Probability part.
We all trade in F&O ,but where Risk is visible & manageable,No room for wish full thinking,few Winning trades under my belt & i become the Black Belt .
What you are referring to is intra-day noise. This effects short term or intra-day traders. Mid to long term traders generally avoid this intra-day noise to ride the trends.
When you look at the performance of the stock market at the end of a trading day it can be hard to work out why shares have either risen or fallen in value.
Broadly speaking, share prices are influenced by news or information: new data on employment, manufacturing, directors’ dealings, political events or even the weather, all kinds of news can influence the way shares move.
The health of the economy has a fundamental influence on share prices because it is ultimately responsible for driving company profits. Broadly speaking, if the economy is growing, company profits improve and shares will become more highly valued. If the economy is weakening, company profits will fall and share prices will go down.
Investors look at a vast amount of data to try and work out what is going to happen to the economy and shift their portfolios before the events occur. This is why you will often see markets move well ahead of an actual event occurring. You may, for example, get little reaction from the stock market when interest rates rise. This is because investors have already anticipated the shift months in advance and adjusted their portfolios beforehand.
You can usually assume that the stock market will anticipate moves in the economy by around six to nine months. So if you want to stay ahead of the game you will need to follow price data as closely as the professionals.
Investor sentiment can lead to irrational buying or selling of shares and result in bull and bear markets. A bull market is when share prices rise while a bear market is when they fall. In the technology boom of the late 1990s, for example, investors paid extremely high prices for shares and ignored traditional valuation measures, such as P/E ratios. This carried on until 2000 when investors belatedly realised these shares has risen too far and resulted in a three year bear market in shares.
__________________
Best Wishes!
Traderji
...........................................................
in one place i say...........when with maturity at what condition u enter, hold and exit,...........all other r void from mind ..........[if u programme it ,very best].......
u r a SUCCESSFUL TRADER.
WITH REGARDS
oilman5
When you look at the performance of the stock market at the end of a trading day it can be hard to work out why shares have either risen or fallen in value.
Broadly speaking, share prices are influenced by news or information: new data on employment, manufacturing, directors’ dealings, political events or even the weather, all kinds of news can influence the way shares move.
The health of the economy has a fundamental influence on share prices because it is ultimately responsible for driving company profits. Broadly speaking, if the economy is growing, company profits improve and shares will become more highly valued. If the economy is weakening, company profits will fall and share prices will go down.
Investors look at a vast amount of data to try and work out what is going to happen to the economy and shift their portfolios before the events occur. This is why you will often see markets move well ahead of an actual event occurring. You may, for example, get little reaction from the stock market when interest rates rise. This is because investors have already anticipated the shift months in advance and adjusted their portfolios beforehand.
You can usually assume that the stock market will anticipate moves in the economy by around six to nine months. So if you want to stay ahead of the game you will need to follow price data as closely as the professionals.
Investor sentiment can lead to irrational buying or selling of shares and result in bull and bear markets. A bull market is when share prices rise while a bear market is when they fall. In the technology boom of the late 1990s, for example, investors paid extremely high prices for shares and ignored traditional valuation measures, such as P/E ratios. This carried on until 2000 when investors belatedly realised these shares has risen too far and resulted in a three year bear market in shares.
__________________
Best Wishes!
Traderji
...........................................................
in one place i say...........when with maturity at what condition u enter, hold and exit,...........all other r void from mind ..........[if u programme it ,very best].......
u r a SUCCESSFUL TRADER.
WITH REGARDS
oilman5
some imp. question asked first.............what u r? know u.........ur strength.....weakness
know market........its dynamics.........with experience more ,u learn more.....it offers oppurtunity.........where u dont know or read wrongly............its threat.......may kill u.
survive first then............swot.
2nd level..........where u stand up better than others in this arena?learn debrief
how much info u can handle ?.......can u represent them objectively,........pref mathematically...........
........u have to be crystal clear.........sharp'....by cv.......apply as oppurtunity comes.
.......develop a harmony in u.........a trading personality........see cv,uasish,saint......meet them ,talk to them..........u shall realise what i mean
know market........its dynamics.........with experience more ,u learn more.....it offers oppurtunity.........where u dont know or read wrongly............its threat.......may kill u.
survive first then............swot.
2nd level..........where u stand up better than others in this arena?learn debrief
how much info u can handle ?.......can u represent them objectively,........pref mathematically...........
........u have to be crystal clear.........sharp'....by cv.......apply as oppurtunity comes.
.......develop a harmony in u.........a trading personality........see cv,uasish,saint......meet them ,talk to them..........u shall realise what i mean
trader F........eod player,news study.........whether its for dumping/may create euphoria.
cool enough to get out if wrong.
................
trader G.......amateur trader like me[different profession...loser in day trade]has a list of around 80 stock in different sector,all he knows of fundamentals.......at what condition they shall move up.....track result and order flow,also macro economy.so when big fall comes he sees how far big fall possible,when pro starts accumulation........from chart he see just accumulation.......and big volume charning at top to get out. no he dont use stop.........but definitely sell total portfolio.......yes this amateur earn 100%return in all last 5 yr,including this yr....40%........trade only on those stock where he knows,has a notebook......on which fundamental change offer an oppurtunity for which stock[groupA and midcap.....member of equitymaster,nothing else....through ***** base see free data
....definitely give 2hr a day in study...and weekend portfolio analysis.....definitely buy after big fall .......a contrarian character.
.............................................................
yes i have seen them........not while they bloom,after in their maturity.......though 6 of them r different........deadly accurate in their craft......no hotchpotch.common theme......to reach there they evolve.......and stick to it.another thing.......they r honest
[though trader E hides to his staff,trader C braggs regarding market opinion as profession.trader F....regarding his job success]...........commitment exceptionally high.
..........................
with regards to all
cool enough to get out if wrong.
................
trader G.......amateur trader like me[different profession...loser in day trade]has a list of around 80 stock in different sector,all he knows of fundamentals.......at what condition they shall move up.....track result and order flow,also macro economy.so when big fall comes he sees how far big fall possible,when pro starts accumulation........from chart he see just accumulation.......and big volume charning at top to get out. no he dont use stop.........but definitely sell total portfolio.......yes this amateur earn 100%return in all last 5 yr,including this yr....40%........trade only on those stock where he knows,has a notebook......on which fundamental change offer an oppurtunity for which stock[groupA and midcap.....member of equitymaster,nothing else....through ***** base see free data
....definitely give 2hr a day in study...and weekend portfolio analysis.....definitely buy after big fall .......a contrarian character.
.............................................................
yes i have seen them........not while they bloom,after in their maturity.......though 6 of them r different........deadly accurate in their craft......no hotchpotch.common theme......to reach there they evolve.......and stick to it.another thing.......they r honest
[though trader E hides to his staff,trader C braggs regarding market opinion as profession.trader F....regarding his job success]...........commitment exceptionally high.
..........................
with regards to all
simply excellent !!!
could you give me some idea which website would give me fair amount of fundamental information about companies?
regards,
nick
www.equitymaster.com
internal research report.....of all std broking house........like hdfc,icici,sharekhan,indian info,motilal, angel....best of all et research charge 9000per annum.
.......hope it solve ur query
internal research report.....of all std broking house........like hdfc,icici,sharekhan,indian info,motilal, angel....best of all et research charge 9000per annum.
.......hope it solve ur query
www.equitymaster.com
internal research report.....of all std broking house........like hdfc,icici,sharekhan,indian info,motilal, angel....best of all et research charge 9000per annum.
.......hope it solve ur query
internal research report.....of all std broking house........like hdfc,icici,sharekhan,indian info,motilal, angel....best of all et research charge 9000per annum.
.......hope it solve ur query
regards,
nick
so ta.........do u know?
..........of course not........only some aspect.
first study maxim.........
1]price reflects definitely all known things..........and expected event,but not acts of GOD........swiftly reacts.....to reach new equilibrium.
2]study of past........shows on similar type of info/condition how it may behave....based on human participant on market.
3]prediction of price impossible..........early trend change allow u chance to earn by trend continuity. those short players on nifty.......r still earning from jan'08.......though definitely book profit and derisk.....as per their depth on market.
4]throw away why?........learn to react........think on probability
5] classical ta believes in pattern ,skill of analyst to read market psychology
6] modern ta.....stresses on statistical interpretation of chance, programme generated signal and condition of its validity.
............................................
btw......skill of mm and skepism + survival instinct is order of day in modern indian market
..........of course not........only some aspect.
first study maxim.........
1]price reflects definitely all known things..........and expected event,but not acts of GOD........swiftly reacts.....to reach new equilibrium.
2]study of past........shows on similar type of info/condition how it may behave....based on human participant on market.
3]prediction of price impossible..........early trend change allow u chance to earn by trend continuity. those short players on nifty.......r still earning from jan'08.......though definitely book profit and derisk.....as per their depth on market.
4]throw away why?........learn to react........think on probability
5] classical ta believes in pattern ,skill of analyst to read market psychology
6] modern ta.....stresses on statistical interpretation of chance, programme generated signal and condition of its validity.
............................................
btw......skill of mm and skepism + survival instinct is order of day in modern indian market
so a trade-learner knows what to read........knowledge is over........however he does not know how market works............this he has to learn by self
...........................
i just put some facts
1.MARKET IS NOT PREDICTABLE,PATIENCE PAYS
2.BASED ON OPPURTUNITY AS DEFINED ,EFFICIENT MARKET OBSERVER CAN MAKE MONEY OUT OF MARKET.
3.MANY A TIME U R WRONG,JUST LOSE LESS.......SOMETIMES U R RIGHT.........USE BETTER MONEY MANAGEMENT TO EARN OUT OF IT.
4.TREND PLAN IS EASIER TO FOLLOW
5.TRADEZONE IS EASIER TO DEFINE...........DIFFICULT TO MAKE MONEY OUT OF IT.
6.KILL UR INVESTMENT AND GAMBLING ATTITUDE ..........BEFORE THEY RUIN U.
7.WITH TIME U CAN LEARN..........WITHOUT A DEFINED SYSTEM......ITS ALMOST IMPOSSIBLE TO SURVIVE IN MARKET
8.UNDERSTAND TREND TERMINATION.
9.RISK ANALYSIS IS MUST,THROW AWAY....HOPE,FEAR,GREED
10.DEFINE A TIME FRAME IN WHICH U CAN OUTGUESS OTHER TRADER ON REGULAR BASIS[UR EARNING STATEMENT ,DRAWDOWN ANALYSIS TELLS U].......JUST STICK TO IT
.......................................................................
BYE BYE TODAY
[dhakkan..secret of a trader as told to u is still secret]
...........................
i just put some facts
1.MARKET IS NOT PREDICTABLE,PATIENCE PAYS
2.BASED ON OPPURTUNITY AS DEFINED ,EFFICIENT MARKET OBSERVER CAN MAKE MONEY OUT OF MARKET.
3.MANY A TIME U R WRONG,JUST LOSE LESS.......SOMETIMES U R RIGHT.........USE BETTER MONEY MANAGEMENT TO EARN OUT OF IT.
4.TREND PLAN IS EASIER TO FOLLOW
5.TRADEZONE IS EASIER TO DEFINE...........DIFFICULT TO MAKE MONEY OUT OF IT.
6.KILL UR INVESTMENT AND GAMBLING ATTITUDE ..........BEFORE THEY RUIN U.
7.WITH TIME U CAN LEARN..........WITHOUT A DEFINED SYSTEM......ITS ALMOST IMPOSSIBLE TO SURVIVE IN MARKET
8.UNDERSTAND TREND TERMINATION.
9.RISK ANALYSIS IS MUST,THROW AWAY....HOPE,FEAR,GREED
10.DEFINE A TIME FRAME IN WHICH U CAN OUTGUESS OTHER TRADER ON REGULAR BASIS[UR EARNING STATEMENT ,DRAWDOWN ANALYSIS TELLS U].......JUST STICK TO IT
.......................................................................
BYE BYE TODAY
[dhakkan..secret of a trader as told to u is still secret]
Jus going thru this thread from start, Its amazing... Its not actually words, Its a collection of blunders by many beginners including me... 'am going thru the rest... Anyways, Keep going...
Thanks,
Sats.
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