lost too much money

[MaxBombay]

Re: How to make profit in stock market

Dear All,

I am trading for many years, I have lost too much money. Can any successful person in this world teach me how to make profit in Cash or Futurs market .

Market looser

We both are in same boat, I lost lot of money in 2006 and then quit trading, then again I lost money in 2007 and finally quit again in march 2008. Then I did tons of research, I remember days I did not sleep because I was back testing my theories and trying to learn from mistakes I made.

Then I started trading again in June 2008 and earned some trades and lost some, I recovered all money lost in 2008 but lost all again due to over trading. Now I have learned few more lessons and now back in trade again with money management, strategy and concentration.

I know, I have lot to learn and I will win because I want to win.

I will recommend you buy some books on trading and read them. Trading is more of psychological game then technical game. Don't listen to all jerks on TV and your chimp portfolio manager who give you calls and sms after every 100 points market move. Make your own strategy, back test it and then trade with money management and no emotions. Trade up to what you can loose comfortably and can still remain in trade.

<sarcasm>

My Indiabulls portfolio manager is so chimp, every times he calls and tell me to do something, it never happens, many times he just messages like this on *****,
SHORRRRRRRRRRRRTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTT, JUST SHORRRRRRRRRRRRRRTTTTTTTTTTTTTTT,
LE LO LE LO, JI BARKE LE LO.......................
AJ SHOTE BHAI KA DIN HAI (anil ambani group), KAL MOTE BAHI KA DIN HAI (Mukesh Ambani group)

They all message you from their a$$es and what they are told. They are not investing their own money so they won't bother if trade goes wrong. Do not follow anyone, make your own call and trade it, the more you will listen to these people the more you will get confused.

Hight of chimpanzees. On 2nd July 2008 One day my portfolio manager messaged me about nifty futures and it went something like this

10.30 AM Manager > SHORTRTTRRTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTT
10.31 AM me > at what level xxxxx?
10.55 AM Manager > SHORTTTTTTTT NIFTY 3845
10.56 AM me > shorted nifty 3847
11.10 AM nifty 3832 ( i am happy person)
11.24 AM nifty 3842 (damn i lost its back to where i shortd)
11.39 AM nifty 3858 (damn its up, lets wait)
11.40 AM me > xxxxxxxx nifty is 3860 what is the stop loss ??
11.54 AM nifty 3882 ( I am -40 point)
11.55 AM me > xxxxxxxxxxxx should i exit ???????
12.25 AM nifty 3930 (-80 I am screwed)
12.26 AM ( i am confused and screwed)
12.27 AM me > HELLO xxxxxxxxxxxxxx, you said short nifty at3847 now its trading 3930 what to do?????????????????????
12.30 AM Manager is ideal
12.35 AM nifty 3940 ( i am about -100 point **** I have to close the trade)
1.00 PM me > HELLOOO xxxxxxxxxxxxxx,, are you there????????

nifty closed at 4072 on that day, i lost 100 points and my portfolio manager made me -100 loss and did not even bother to response. They do like this many many time, i have blocked them after that day.

</sarcasm>

 

[praveen taneja]

wow wat a great thread want to tell everybody i m champion in losing whoever want to learn different ways of losing can pm me thanx ...........

 

[uasish]

I learnt 1 imp. thing after loosing continuously in Daytrading,i sent an email to Larry Williams few years back (as Larry Won the World Championship in trading consequtively & he responds to all e-mail personally).He wrote me back WHY DONT YOU DO THE OPPOSITE.

By that time i was few Lacks minus & was in the verge of collapsing,suddenly with this mail i just cursed him....... is this any type of Strategy ?? ,NO formula ,as he has attained so now he is showering all type of Craps.

After few Hrs,i suddenly thought if only if all my Longs/Shorts where truly opposite then i would be now few Lacks (+)ve.My actual Ledger which was then (-) could actually had been (+) WoW ! Bingo MONEY can be made!!!!!!! i the Gr8est Dumb of ths Earth if only if could have just done the opposite only then this very Dumb could EARN !!!!!!!!!!

So 1st & foremost is to get the DIRECTION right.

 

[uasish]

Then my only quest at those time is how to get the direction Right.Searched Net from evening 4.00 pm to 11.00 pm (as the cyber cafe used to close at 11pm,at that time i did'nt had a computer & internet connection at home & was going to 'Chadni-Chowk' area everyday to do Dabba Trading).On Sat / Sunday morn 9.30am to 11.00 pm with few mins break for Lunch & tea.Probably i went through ALL type of Sites & suggestions to get the Direction right.Not being statisfied,becoz i use to see charts in Bse/Nse sites,mostly Bse (as they used Metastock so later on i went for MS only),and in those past charts i could not find those suggestions to be fruitfull.
Then i went to Vision Book distributor of Kolkata,(8 yrs back this online Book purchase was not so popular),bought few books & read many standing there (the store manager was very friendly,when his daily tea & fag needs where being taken care of & where can he get a mad who stays from 9.30 till 8.00 pm days together).On my way back used to go to the cyber cafe to see past charts about what they preach in books,nothing no significant way to find what the Next bar is going to do.

After 2 months was frustrated ,there was a new building under construction beside that Book distributors building,1 day while taking a break to take Tea & snacks,i found the masons where constructing a stairway,you know how they build staircase with equal height one above the other.Bingo !! it Hit me like a thunderstorm,if the Range of previous Bar's certain % is Up then Price is going Up the staircase if certain % of previous bar's range is crossed downwards then Price is going Down the staircase.

This became my 1st LOGIC to understand Price's Direction.

 

[vvvv]

ashishda,
we need sumthin more of this from u...pls continue with ur experiences as these will help us to get better...
i havent seen those hard times but theres a lot more to learn from these experiences of others.

 

[devangan123]

Re: How to make profit in stock market

We both are in same boat, I lost lot of money in 2006 and then quit trading, then again I lost money in 2007 and finally quit again in march 2008. Then I did tons of research, I remember days I did not sleep because I was back testing my theories and trying to learn from mistakes I made.

Then I started trading again in June 2008 and earned some trades and lost some, I recovered all money lost in 2008 but lost all again due to over trading. Now I have learned few more lessons and now back in trade again with money management, strategy and concentration.

I know, I have lot to learn and I will win because I want to win.

I will recommend you buy some books on trading and read them. Trading is more of psychological game then technical game. Don't listen to all jerks on TV and your chimp portfolio manager who give you calls and sms after every 100 points market move. Make your own strategy, back test it and then trade with money management and no emotions. Trade up to what you can loose comfortably and can still remain in trade.

<sarcasm>

My Indiabulls portfolio manager is so chimp, every times he calls and tell me to do something, it never happens, many times he just messages like this on *****,
SHORRRRRRRRRRRRTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTT, JUST SHORRRRRRRRRRRRRRTTTTTTTTTTTTTTT,
LE LO LE LO, JI BARKE LE LO.......................
AJ SHOTE BHAI KA DIN HAI (anil ambani group), KAL MOTE BAHI KA DIN HAI (Mukesh Ambani group)

They all message you from their a$$es and what they are told. They are not investing their own money so they won't bother if trade goes wrong. Do not follow anyone, make your own call and trade it, the more you will listen to these people the more you will get confused.

Hight of chimpanzees. On 2nd July 2008 One day my portfolio manager messaged me about nifty futures and it went something like this

10.30 AM Manager > SHORTRTTRRTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTT
10.31 AM me > at what level xxxxx?
10.55 AM Manager > SHORTTTTTTTT NIFTY 3845
10.56 AM me > shorted nifty 3847
11.10 AM nifty 3832 ( i am happy person)
11.24 AM nifty 3842 (damn i lost its back to where i shortd)
11.39 AM nifty 3858 (damn its up, lets wait)
11.40 AM me > xxxxxxxx nifty is 3860 what is the stop loss ??
11.54 AM nifty 3882 ( I am -40 point)
11.55 AM me > xxxxxxxxxxxx should i exit ???????
12.25 AM nifty 3930 (-80 I am screwed)
12.26 AM ( i am confused and screwed)
12.27 AM me > HELLO xxxxxxxxxxxxxx, you said short nifty at3847 now its trading 3930 what to do?????????????????????
12.30 AM Manager is ideal
12.35 AM nifty 3940 ( i am about -100 point **** I have to close the trade)
1.00 PM me > HELLOOO xxxxxxxxxxxxxx,, are you there????????

nifty closed at 4072 on that day, i lost 100 points and my portfolio manager made me -100 loss and did not even bother to response. They do like this many many time, i have blocked them after that day.

</sarcasm>

Dear MaxBombay

I know my below message is harsh and rude sorry for this but it is necessary

Can you share what did u back tested by awaking in nights , if u can not use most simples thing in trading that is STOP LOSS

The easiest thing in this world to blame others for own loss , we all love blaming others but in actual if blame our self and learn from mistakes then we will never be in such situations.

If I take your example when your RM called you to short NIFTY , first question should be from your side should have been what is the Stop Loss or would have put stoploss at own according to your pockets like 20 -30 points .

Then nifty went 15 point below your shorting rate then simply wold have moved your stoploss closer to your shorting rate and would have protect himself from such losses .

It was so simple but most of traders live in fantasy that their is some method either through tip provider or RM calls or technical analysis where we can earn for sure shot.

I do not think Any trader can earn in this stock market for sure shot by Any buy / sell signal in technical analysis or any buy / sell calls from any body without using a proper Stop Loss.

And this is old moral of story:

Looser gets losses because they waste time in blaming others for their losses and Winners get profits because they learns from their mistakes and never repeat their mistakes.

Once Again Sorry for being Rude

Regards
Devan

 

[praveen taneja]

Re: How to make profit in stock market

Dear MaxBombay

I know my below message is harsh and rude sorry for this but it is necessary

Can you share what did u back tested by awaking in nights , if u can not use most simples thing in trading that is STOP LOSS

The easiest thing in this world to blame others for own loss , we all love blaming others but in actual if blame our self and learn from mistakes then we will never be in such situations.

If I take your example when your RM called you to short NIFTY , first question should be from your side should have been what is the Stop Loss or would have put stoploss at own according to your pockets like 20 -30 points .

Then nifty went 15 point below your shorting rate then simply wold have moved your stoploss closer to your shorting rate and would have protect himself from such losses .

It was so simple but most of traders live in fantasy that their is some method either through tip provider or RM calls or technical analysis where we can earn for sure shot.

I do not think Any trader can earn in this stock market for sure shot by Any buy / sell signal in technical analysis or any buy / sell calls from any body without using a proper Stop Loss.

And this is old moral of story:

Looser gets losses because they waste time in blaming others for their losses and Winners get profits because they learns from their mistakes and never repeat their mistakes.

Once Again Sorry for being Rude

Regards
Devan

Dear devan u cant b harsh on any one bcoz loser losses bcoz he lac some of winning strategy.If he was winning dont hav bothered to vist traderji or any other forum n must b enjoying with family or (GF) dont know his age with the pool of profit.I know u never meant to offend but stop loss is the frst point which n o loser use /. I too accept lost so much n never bothered to use stop loss.N when my trading is about to stop due to loss now i learn stop loss.Now doing trade in option after watching levels of Czar n savant sir n sunils chowkidar n sharavani.averaging there levels n try to buy put or call bcoz now dont hav much to lose.Tried many time to read TEACH A MAN thread but cant go in understanding charting must b lack of interest or time all my fault cant blame others .in the end want to say all the losers like me always sharpen ur two weapons PATIENCE N STOP LOSS if want to b in this mkt

 

[devangan123]

Re: How to make profit in stock market

Dear devan u cant b harsh on any one bcoz loser losses bcoz he lac some of winning strategy.If he was winning dont hav bothered to vist traderji or any other forum n must b enjoying with family or (GF) dont know his age with the pool of profit.I know u never meant to offend but stop loss is the frst point which n o loser use /. I too accept lost so much n never bothered to use stop loss.N when my trading is about to stop due to loss now i learn stop loss.Now doing trade in option after watching levels of Czar n savant sir n sunils chowkidar n sharavani.averaging there levels n try to buy put or call bcoz now dont hav much to lose.Tried many time to read TEACH A MAN thread but cant go in understanding charting must b lack of interest or time all my fault cant blame others .in the end want to say all the losers like me always sharpen ur two weapons PATIENCE N STOP LOSS if want to b in this mkt

Dear
Praveen

I asked sorry in my post only for being harsh , and I believe their is no winning strategy without using proper Stop Loss , even god himself comes in front of me and ask to buy ABC stock then my first question will be God thats ok but what is a stoploss .

A looser always looses more because he always trade with one aim to recover his losses . (And that also as early as possible)

If any trader lost some amount than please he / she stop trading for at least for one month and forget about the money he lost and think about the money he has left with him . Then do paper trading with 10 different trading strategies for first 15 days and then short list 2-4 best strategy and then select best strategy in next 15 days.

After that he / she should start trading with only 25 % of its capital if gets success with his strategy then only put additional strategy , because paper trading and actual trading are 2 different thing , many strategies works in paper trading but do not work in real life trading .

if he fails again then again stop trading for one month and repeat the whole process.

I know its very easy to write and very hard to implement but i have implemented successfully at own so others can also do only thing u need is desire .

This whole above process will take max 2-3 months to learn how to trade profitably for years but if some trader think giving 2-3 months is waste of time then sorry to say but he / she deserves only one thing out of this cruel stock market that is Losses and nothing else

Regards
Devan

 

[praveen taneja]

Re: How to make profit in stock market

Dear
Praveen

I asked sorry in my post only for being harsh , and I believe their is no winning strategy without using proper Stop Loss , even god himself comes in front of me and ask to buy ABC stock then my first question will be God thats ok but what is a stoploss .

A looser always looses more because he always trade with one aim to recover his losses . (And that also as early as possible)

If any trader lost some amount than please he / she stop trading for at least for one month and forget about the money he lost and think about the money he has left with him . Then do paper trading with 10 different trading strategies for first 15 days and then short list 2-4 best strategy and then select best strategy in next 15 days.

After that he / she should start trading with only 25 % of its capital if gets success with his strategy then only put additional strategy , because paper trading and actual trading are 2 different thing , many strategies works in paper trading but do not work in real life trading .

if he fails again then again stop trading for one month and repeat the whole process.

I know its very easy to write and very hard to implement but i have implemented successfully at own so others can also do only thing u need is desire .

This whole above process will take max 2-3 months to learn how to trade profitably for years but if some trader think giving 2-3 months is waste of time then sorry to say but he / she deserves only one thing out of this cruel stock market that is Losses and nothing else

Regards
Devan

U r right bro thats why i said need of patience is must as leaving trading n just watching needs lots of patience instead of doing trade daily try to wait for the kill n clear trend n then trade thnx for the reply

 

[Prabhjeet]

There are thousands of mistakes that one can make in markets and there are equal no. of solutions, these are some of the mistakes and solutions that I went through my trading career :-

Problem 1) Started as an investor and then was afraid when I saw 25% of my account evaporate into thin air

Solution 1) Read some technical analysis and found out the stoploss is the most important thing even for an investor


Problem 2) Even after putting my stoplosses I was down 10% next month, reason, I had no money management in place so whatever I was earning was turning to losses with few bad trades that had larger positions.

Solution 2) Divide my money equally into 6 different trades with equal risk but complete money management was still lacking


Problem 3) Was trading futures with all the leverage available and the movement of stocks made me look like a crazy man who watched the computer till markets close and then till they opened again

Solution 3) Put 1% risk rule for each trade and suddenly I felt like a man just getting out of jail, money management at its full use was the biggest forward step for me.

Problem 4) Was trying to make money from dozens of systems and was confused which system to be used at which time

Solution 4) Got it thoroughly drilled into my mind that no system makes money all the time and I am bound to bear some losses everytime hence started using only 4 systems

Problem 5) I was ok with putting stoplosses but was never able to Let the profits run, always became afraid and took small profits

Solution 5) I thought in my mind that If I am ready to give the markets all that I have then I should not be afraid to take what all market has. Hence I get out only at my initial stoploss or trailing stoploss never take profits off the table.

Problem 6)Was making money but not propotionate to the amount of time I spent

Solution 6) Met a wonderful person named SAINT who guided me to knew world of trading and now I cant find a way how to thank him as much as he has done for me.


I know there are hundreds of problems still to come but the only hard thing is to first recognize them, accept them and then they almost automatically solve themselves.

Only one line to wrap it up " Darr ke aagey jeet hai"

Happy Trading