Restoring Traders/Investors Faith into Investing

Mr.G

Well-Known Member
I just make a portfolio with diversified Equity Funds and add 30-40% of Midcap Funds ( Because of perceived Bull years in future). They are quite volatile. Small caps even more. So i dont have guts to put more :). Best would be to start SIP aggresively when market tanks bigtime but that is history now - maybe wont get that soon and its so hard to do it ...
Try investing in microcap stocks. Even the utterance of the stock your buying makes the price flutter like a headless chicken.
 

Einstein

Well-Known Member
Just few week ago, I was looking for micro-cap stocks, I had a list of 40-50 stock of companies with market cap below 500 crore, I was looking for something useful, find none.

add: few were okay(below okay) like the byke hospitality and unitedtea But I think microcap is full of cra p.

@steve

Yes its true, they keep changing after a year of 2 this is for majority of the mutual funds.
 
I have invested in one stock but it's price has gone slightly down. What should i do. I can bear the loss by selling it, but should i hold it at least tomorrow and wait to see if it rises to give me profit. Approach ?
 

Einstein

Well-Known Member
My father in law follows a gentleman from 2001 ! His Portfolio has grown exponentially from 12 lakhs on Diwali 2001 to over 6.53 crores (as on 31st Mar 2014) ! He has been Investing regularly so dont know what is his capital in this 6.5 crore is ! Do know that he has stocks that have multiplied upto 40 times ! 6 baggers are very common !
Some of his holdings : Pantaloon retail (Exited), TV18(Exited), Bharti(Exited), Page (holding), Hawkins (Holding), Asian Paints (holding).... latest holdings in last few years : Cera(already multiplied 4+times in just abt 2 years) , Cummins, Repco entered on listing at ~176and added on increase of Rs.100/- at 275 and then at 335 and also small qty at 410 and now its 460 !
Luckily I too have a few shares out of these at awesome returns but have not been disciplined to get full benefit of the guidance!

Investing choro, subha uthkar aisai sasur k pair chua karo tun.. kripa honi shuru ho jayegi..:rofl:
 

Einstein

Well-Known Member
I have invested in one stock but it's price has gone slightly down. What should i do. I can bear the loss by selling it, but should i hold it at least tomorrow and wait to see if it rises to give me profit. Approach ?
Aapka tho balvivah(child marriage) ka case lagta hai, pata nahi kya milega hai..!!

name the stock please.
 

TracerBullet

Well-Known Member
Hi,Einstein and Members,

I have no idea in Mutual Funds...2012 start invest in 5 Funds with Dividend reinvestment plan..Except HDFC its closed ended plan and 2013 invest in Birla Frontline growth option..(Report was attached)

Before started i was confused...where and which fund to invest...Finally chosen Bajaj Capital all in under one roof...!!! Its near my house, branch manager also friendly.,

Last week i met branch manager, He recommends 4 fund they are..

1.HDFC EQUITY FUND
2.ICICI DISCOVERY FUND
3.IDFC PREMIER EQUITY
4.ICICI WEALTH BUILDER FUND (Unit Linked)

KIndly review above funds..if any suggestion..welcome..!!!

My Doubts,

a)Which is better Growth or Dividend Re-investment plan (Quantity will Increase)

b)Which is best Single Invest or SIP or Buy on dips NAV (Birla divided yield & icici pru dynamic =2 Funds added buy on dips..but i was missed Reliance vision @ 28 nav level)

Comprehensive Portfolio Performance & Valuation Report

1) Dividend reinvestment vs growth - I see no reason to use dividend reinvestment. Use growth. I dont know if the dividend is taxed, if it is then its bad for long term gains

2) Bajaj Capital all in under one roof - I think people dont understand the difference MF expenses make. I strongly feel that we should only go for Direct funds instead of using distributors. Direct funds have approx 0.5-1% lower expenses.
Just a simple example which i think looks correct - for last 20 years, say we get 30x returns aggregate. If there was just 1% extra expense in the first year, that tiny 1% is now 30% less due to missed compounded returns on it. Imagine this happens every year. Are you willing to pay them for some minor website facility??
Look another way - if you have 50L portfolio and non-direct MF has 1% extra expense - you are indirectly paying 50k every year to Bajaj - WHY?

3) the funds all look good. I am not familiar with Rel vision & Birla divided yield. ULIP i think is not needed - they used to have high expenses. Instead prefer term insurance - keep insurance and investment seperate.
Look here for good funds.

4) SIP vs single investment - SIP will average out your cost reducing risk over the SIP period. Its generally better as it will reduce risk. But do understand that SIP is not magic - If you are already invested with big amount say 10L then a tiny sip of say 10k will not make any difference for your 10L. So just think SIP as a way to reduce risk on fresh investment.
i think SIP is a very good way to invest. If we try to time, behavioural biases make us invest near top and sell near bottom.
If you are a trader and track Nifty, even better way was suggested by SmartTrade. I dont have the post but this is what he suggested
"Whenever there is a dip of 500 points I buy these funds. In case there is no dip in a month then I buy the months budget on last day of the month. I always felt that we are sitting in front of the terminal every day, So why depend on some arbitrary date for SIP ? We can invest when market takes a dip"

These posts may help - here, here and here

Try investing in microcap stocks. Even the utterance of the stock your buying makes the price flutter like a headless chicken.
:) yes sir. This is one place where i doubt big Mutual Funds can do well. But need to have skill in picking good stocks when they are in trouble and sit tight. There are too many minefields here. I hope to read books and have some ability before the next major crisis in the next decade or two. For now, i am better off with MFs and their sureshot relative performance.

Even if we can equal MF performance minus expenses with normal stocks, it may be worth it but its not for everyone.

Yes its true, they keep changing after a year of 2 this is for majority of the mutual funds.
I am sorry to say but all of your replies are spreading FUD. You didnt give any info to backup your claims and keep spreading nonsense about terrible performance, about 10-20% aggregate returns and now this.

1) Prashant Jain of HDFC has been with them for the last 20+ years. Yes fund manager changes happen sometimes, people retire, people leave - but you anyway should keep track of MF performance every few years.

2) The links i gave for morning star/ VS / fundsindia all try to evulate all of this before making recomendation and they explain it too.

3) There is no reason to believe that the next FM will be bad. In any case, Funds have teams of people and processes in place . Fund manager is a big component but he is not everything. Consistent Historical outperformance against benchmarks is enough for me.

Maybe i am completely wrong, but I am beginning to think that you are selling these so called portfolio managers or you do it yourself. If so, please make it clear. Nothing wrong, you certainly have skills in picking stocks (i have none... ) but dont spread FUD.

Anyway, i am done with this thread since you have nothing fruiteful to add about these portfolio managers ...
 

Einstein

Well-Known Member
@Tracerbullet, You should start reading between the lines

Yes its true, they keep changing after a year of 2 this is for majority of the mutual funds.

I invest my own, I m not a fund manager. and I don't promote anyone or anything except 'value investing'. I just speak my mind, anyways, I don't think there are more then 1 dozen investors in this whole forum so who cares?
 
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Mr.G

Well-Known Member
1)

:) yes sir. This is one place where i doubt big Mutual Funds can do well. But need to have skill in picking good stocks when they are in trouble and sit tight. There are too many minefields here. I hope to read books and have some ability before the next major crisis in the next decade or two. For now, i am better off with MFs and their sureshot relative performance.
I myself hate MFs, See its the best option for a common man. Lets go into the history of these MFs. It was designed to service the need for professional investment management in common people. Earlier it was limited to the rich who could afford PMs.

Now as PMs are a personal choice. The MFs are under high regulation. Everything is fine and dandy. But these regulations tie the hands of these funds. They miss out on "special situation investing", the bread and butter of professional investors.

PMs are not bound by any regulation and are free to function as they wish. This gives them more leverage and can design a portfolio for every client.

Nows PMs are not registered and work for cartels of HNIs. These are under the personal service of the cartel and dont need to get registered as he is employee and not company.

Now PMs mostly who are available or known to common people are scams working as fraud. Original PMs work as freelancers and join company as employee as contractual worker.

Its best for common people to stick with mutual funds, but the mutual fund is against investor intrest. It is true that money grows in them ,but all factors are against it making a profit. Its better to invest in index funds.

On a last note for PMs, most guys in the market are idiots and frauds. But there are a FEW gems too. But due to the bias and free entry and investor illiteracy that is doctrines for mutual funds, discourage small PMs.

For true performance of PMs as available today, look at hedge funds circa.1920s, it was just the aftermath of the great depression. Modern hedge funds are bastardized with debt and "modern portfolio theory".

See those classic hedge funds run a hundred years ago. The same performance is still in private PMs.

This finished the debate.
 

Einstein

Well-Known Member
@TracerBullet,

Alright, Tell me how am I misleading peoples???

If you don't have the basic intelligence of understand few simple concept you don't need to **** on this thread. Stop barking and keep trading.