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oilman5

Well-Known Member
How do we differentiate sideways market from trending market. Eyeballing the chart is the best way. But to have a system in place... we need a criteria which, if filled, is officially sideways. That is when we shift our mindset from trend-is-our-friend to fade-the-extreme.

This is a grey area that i have been working on for a long time, without much success. How to define sideways market ?

.....

To an untrained eye, keeping it simple is the best. To a trained eye, there is always a missing piece of info that could help in avoiding a failed trade. The search goes on...

answer is.............After a lot many years, I came to a conclusion that there is no indicator which will foretell you the timing of the desired movement. Until I started 'feeling' the pulse of the market. No not through news and impact of global developments etc, but purely on the basis of simple charts for different TFs. IMO there is no other way but this 'unprofessional way' to time the movement.

With all the indicators, formulas, and programming, codes we are just beating around the bush, just feeling that we are near the destination, which is not to be.

Eyeballing is necessary and only an experienced eye can detect the move early and quite often precisely. And IMO this is the hard fact. You would be surprised to know that I do not use any charts except of a simple CS charts (ofcourse of multiple TFs, simulatenously) and decide on the entry and exit. To be precise, for me it is just the THREE preceeding candles do it all, all other candles are only for purpose of knowing the primary direction of the trend...
 

oilman5

Well-Known Member
I would say that I developed this techinque as I found that once I had developed an option(essentially at the resistance or support, I would be keen to take a reversal trade, in many such occasion the trend would continue after some time and then though it seem a sure continuation of trend, since my orginal decision was reversal I would not take a position in continuation of the trend as it was not what I had anticipitated, through this techinque, since I am already in a Netural Trade, I could exit my loss making reversal trade (which was my main position) and continue holding the trend continuing position as it ran into profits.

The above techinques given large room to accomodate, right decision making errors and hence would advise it to starters, till they have developed a good strike rate sytem which gives high probablity of right signals on entry. Even today, I am stuck on lot of occasion when my system though it me some indications and I do not have conviction on that indication, I enter a Netural Trade first only to then release the loss making trade out and continue holding the profit making trade till the end of holding period.

On the second part, of reviewing the position at the end of review period, I can only tell that once you have done your trading portfolio allocation properly, (which is nothing but portfolio managment - we will discuss later) I do not see any reason for me to jump into any intermiate review. If you are thingking that the losses could be large due to gap up / gap down, that such volatility is factors in that time period portfolio and the overall effect on the total portfolio is small, even if that particular trading portfolio postion goes into a deep loss (which generally does not happen - once you have rigid and dynamic decision making trading system / method.

I recollect mentioning somewhere on this forum that I am like a baker, baking breads to cakes, to cookies in different ovens, and for different baking products, you need different temprature and time settings, I just need to open and check those ovens at those set time and not in between. As such when the timer of different oven stops as per what is being baked inside, i.e. end of my holding period, I exit automatically.
.................pl reread statement of tnsn2345...........how a real trader thinks!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

oilman5

Well-Known Member
Stock market chess
1.there is always a seller for a buyer.see otherside of story,..only one can be right2.evaluate only what matter,nothing more3.chess in totality contain perfect info, unfortunately market is not.4.decifer price, if nothing visible go with intuition[an intellectual skill developed based on pattern study & problem solving skill5.play market with a plan ,longterm or shortterm6.review constantly in eod and adjust accordingly. Look at market’s last day activity and last hr7. don’t waste money[don’t allow loss to run]8.press winner when u have them9.winning reqd not only perfection from u,also mistakes from others.10.when u have got early signal, buy.11.always give high priority with nifty12.development of knowledge , time is money.13.don’t try leverage if u cant handle,use resource wisely14.trade study…never ignore mistake15. stay in your own zone,stock selection16. fundamental contrarian, high level of vision Chess tells u to think /not impulsiveCheck opponent’s pt of view.2.tactics is very imp[don’t only read]4.always see sacrifical trap and positional strategy5.3move attack vs. attack on king .6.refer to move at hand and opponent’s last move7.never allow unnecessary pc loss.8.know how to win ‘won’game.9.play well also watch,opponent may give u opportunity.10.take initiative.11.it’s the center.12.development of pc, it needs purpose13.premature attack is costly.14.chess study..admit blunder and reason of loss15.don’t be flashy to win16.grand master break the rule as he sees better, others understand it later.
.......................an old post of mine of 2007...........always relevent.
 

oilman5

Well-Known Member
'trading is nothing but a bridge competition. cards come ..u have to play.partner is ur system ..u have to tune.play 2/3 yr of practice deal..so with all/various conditions how to react ....is ready for u.opponents r other participants in market...never allow to win.so at best..u can defend ..not to give extra tricks.
but sometimes they overbid ..your hand suggest..something wrong..u got oppurtunity..now double..and ;'score high'....BUY IN OVERSOLD MARKET..OR BOOK PROFIT ..IN OVERVALUED MARKET.
u got a good hand..u have to play as declarer...thats the oppurtunity u must buy..but ready for bad colour brake..by defender.try to score as best as possible with limiting risk.
bidding system...a general trade governing rule by which u decide 'whether to play..or its better to defend'
competitive selection trial..pairs event'...the game played with same card with directional opponent..your score shall be 'comparatively better with others'.............IT IS THE DAYTRADING..UR ULTIMATE SKILL WILL BE TESTED
UNLESS EXECUTION MASTER..AND GREAT SURVIVAL SKILL'DONT COME'...however its a reality checking m/c to know where u stand in trading arena.
 

oilman5

Well-Known Member
NOW u r moving on top...here u atleast know how to survive..irrespective of market u can run ur family by winning against other traders.
........................
so u r developing trading philosophy...plan new arsenal...to fight better.
so it is trade universe.3terms i introduce...exhausive, exclusive and intersection ie. interrelation between 2 element.
EXHAUSIVE..U HAVE TO GO INTO DETAIL
EXCLUSIVE..NO RELATION EXISTS..INDEPENDENT ELEMENT
INRERSECTION;INTERRELATION BETWEEN 2 ELEMENT...INTERRELATIONSHIP BETN MARKET...INTERRELATIONSHIP BETN MANY COMPANY IN A PARTICULAR SECTOR.
exhausive gives micro view.

so before reaching to become a master...one goes through various way to question and answer this 3 element...[may be in different name].he knows how far he understands...his limit..so now practice on regular basis[system]

and follow it diligently[discipline]
so i use 3 statistical term....

now u see all good thread ..search mode..nothing but ..can be expansion of 3 idea.

any other idea....yes EXECUTION.I DONT UNDERSTAND AS SLIPPAGE A BAD ELEMENT..BUT CV OPENS MY EYE,...i miss 3trades for slippage in intraday.
also some profit booking idea in real sense...so the difference with beginner and pro clearer to me..its IMPLEMENTATION.


HENCE THIS KEY WORDS U THINK IN THE LIGHT OF IMPLEMENTATION .
oilman5
 

oilman5

Well-Known Member
Trading successfully is difficult, very difficultThe elements of good trading are: (1) cutting losses.
You have to put indicators in context. They’re background information — never the primary reason for a trade
. the experience of the past few years has emphasized the value of disregarding all considerations except those which relate to price movement, volume and time. If one is endeavoring to realize profits from the principal swings in prices of stocks, it is my opinion that he should disregard fundamental as well as corporate statistics relating to the stocks in which he is trading, stick closely to a study of the action of the market and become deaf and blind to everything else.

There is only one way to achieve success in speculation—through hard work, persistently hard work. If there is any easy money lying around, no one is going to try and give it to me—this I know. My satisfaction always came from beating the market, solving the puzzle. The money was the reward, but it was not the main reason I loved the market. The stock market is the greatest, most complex puzzle ever invented, and it pays the biggest jackpot - Jesse Livermore
A passion for the truth is the essential element of a sound approach to trading. - Chick Goslin
Look at reality. Futures trading is a competition. It is financial warfare. You are trading against thousands of smart, aggressive, extremely well-informed, very well financed, extensively experienced professionals. Look at the facts!
Every trader will be tested emotionally, mentally and monetarily to varying degrees in his career. Most times, it’ll be extremely unpleasant and you’d most likely want to quit right there and then. Only those who can endure this kind of hardship, learn from their mistakes and persevere on will make it.
One of my strengths is the ability to become more aggressive during winning streaks and to do the opposite during a losing streak. This goes against what most people do. You should have a person who has nothing to do with trading who will turn off the trading terminal after a certain amount of losses and send you home; that would save traders thousands.

I am constantly adjusting my trading style to match specific market conditions. For example, on volatile days I generally put fewer orders into the market and execute more directional trades, although I mostly hold them for only a few seconds.

I always set strict daily targets and limits for my profit and loss. The most important element is the stop limit, or simply the size of the loss, which will cause me to turn off my trading screen. I try to liquidate my positions as soon as they start going against me.
You are trading against the wealthiest and most knowledgeable people and organizations in the world.Do not delude yourself, you cannot compete on their terms: information, knowledge, experience, staying power, and so on.Do not spend time and energy trying to figure out why a price moves.Focus all your attention and energy solely on what the price is doing.You are a trader. A trader does not get paid to understand or explain why something has happened. The question "why?" deals with the past. The question "what?" deals with the present and provides the best clues to the future. And never forget that you are trading "futures," not "pasts." Discovering the supposed "why" of a price move will provide you with little more than temporary intellectual comfort. Whereas observing and focusing on what the price has done and is doing will help you anticipate what the price will do in the futureA trader must always feel free to change trading positions on very short notice. And most importantly, you do not need to be good at predicting
That's the problem with amateurs, they only have half a plan, the easy half. They know how much of a profit they're willing to take, but they don't have the foggiest idea how much they're willing to lose. They're like deer in the headlights, they just freeze and wait to get run over. Their plan for a position that goes south is, "Please God, let me out of this and I'll never do it again" but that's bullshit, because if by chance the position turns around, they'll soon forget about God. They'll go back to thinking that they're geniuses, and they'll always do it again, which means that they're sure to get caught, and get caught bad. What most people fail to understand is that while you're losing your money, you're also losing your objectivityThat's why you have to put aside your ego and get out. If you have trouble doing that, as most people do, be like Odysseus: tie yourself to the mast with an automatic stop and take your emotions out of play --------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Speculators and investors who simply guess, follow tips,rumors, newspaper talk and so-called “inside information"have no chance of ever making a success You will make money when you do just the opposite of what the average man or woman tries to do and makes a failure and loses as a result of what they are trying to do
The people who win consistently spend their time refining the basics and making sure they are prepared.
Focus on being profitable for the week - Individual trades may go against you and individual trading days can offer little opportunity. As a senior trader once explained to me, for the active trader, however, there are enough fresh opportunities in a week to make it reasonable to set a goal of being profitable for the week. You won't reach your goal every single week, but the mere act of setting the goal keeps you focused. For example, you don't want to lose so much money in a single day that you can't make it back during the other days of the week. You also don't want to lose so much money on a single trade that you can't come back during the remainder of the day. When you really push yourself to be profitable every week, you don't let individual days get away from you. And when you don't let individual days get away from you, you start managing each trade carefully to ensure that your largest loss won't exceed your largest gain. Time and again I've seen a consistent sign of progress among developing traders: they stop digging themselves into holes.
Always have something to "lean on" - Scalpers will notice heavy and persistent selling at a certain tick, accompanied by large offers in the order book. They'll lean on that information to find a good entry to sell the market. If the offers disappear from the book or if new buyers start lifting those offers in size, they can get out quickly. Knowing you have something to lean on, however, allows you to ride out the noise between entry and exit. As long as what you're leaning on doesn't vanish, you stay with your idea
1) Before you put your capital at risk, have a well-formed trade idea;
2) When your idea pays you out quickly, take some profits;
3) Don't get caught up in individual trades; focus on profitability over a series of trades and days.

It means that success will not be found in better indicators, improved self-help techniques, or any of the endless parade of chart patterns, wave formations, numerology schemes, or moving average arrays.

Rather, success is achieved when we find markets and styles of trading that take maximum advantage of our skills and talents. That keeps us focused on markets and absorbed in them, enabling us--over time--to internalize their patterns.They know that risk control is as important as the other two legs of speculation, selection and timing. That is all this business of commodity trading gets down to, selection, timing, and risk control
May my assessment of today's price action be based upon the facts, all of the facts and nothing but the facts. May I not be influenced by fear, greed or the ill-advised comments of others, which may be made in their interests and not my own. May I take into account the past history laid before me on this chart and make my assessment based on my knowledge, and logic, and not my emotions.
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"Tape reading was an important part of the game; so was beginning at the right time; so was sticking to your position. But my greatest discovery was that a man must study general conditions, to size them so as to be able to anticipate probabilities." Reminiscences of a Stock Operator
There are 5 important achievements that every successful system trader must make.

1) You must know your own weaknesses. Each of us brings strengths and weaknesses to our own trading. Some find it exceedingly difficult not to tinker or play around with the markets when trading and in the process we don't follow our systems; some find it difficult to pull the trigger; some find it difficult to endure drawdowns of any size. Unless you know how you react to the markets and the pressures and elations of trading, you cannot compensate for your weaknesses.

2) You must understand statistics well enough to understand the limitations of trading using only history as our guide. I am constantly surprised by how many people get this wrong. Even the so-called "experts" in trading.

3) You must learn about trading systems, many of them, many different kinds of systems. In this process, you will learn that there are many answers, many paths to profits, but none of them are as neat and palatable as we might wish.

4) You must learn about brokers, markets, execution, risk, slippage, and other operational issues that affect trading profits. The best way to learn these issues is to start trading somewhere using a small account. It needs to be big enough that the losses matter but not so big that you will bankrupt yourself if you lose the entire account.

5) You must learn about yourself and how you react to all the items 1 to 4 above. This is perhaps the most important knowledge. How to fit your own personality, weaknesses and strengths, into the trading ecosystem. You might find you are bored with long-term system, or that you can't stand looking at screens, or that you need a robobroker to execute since you won't follow your systems closely enough. You will only learn this by being honest with yourself and by reflecting on what works and doesn't.

The best possible way to learn is to sit side by side with someone who knows what they are doing, but this is not possible for most, so you will likely need to find another way.

As far as a specific course of action, which is what you have asked for, I will offer one way that I think works pretty well. If you persevere and if you reflect on your own condition honestly, you have a good chance at success if you follow this course.

1) Buy some testing software and learn some of the well-known systems that work. There are many examples of systems that work out there. Play around with them, change them and see what happens. I'm obviously biased in my opinion of what software you should buy but I leave that decision to you.

2) Read and Study Trading. Initially, I suggest buying the Modus course. It is a very good foundation for people who don't know where to begin.

3) Start trading as soon as you think you are ready. Start small and don't worry about the profits, worry about what you learn about the markets and yourself. Consider your initial losses as tuition that all traders pay.

4) Honestly assess yourself on a regular basis. What did you learn? what are you having trouble with? What do you need to compensate for?

5) Repeat starting at 1).

One thing that troubles many people is the high cost of software and courses. Consider however, the high cost of trading incorretly as the alternative. If you can't afford software, save up until you can. If you can't afford money for a course, you likely can't afford to lose as much money as you will if you start trading without understanding what you are doing.

Last of all, don't be afraid to ask for the advice of others, even to pay for it where appropriate.

Keep one thing in mind, however, sometimes even successful traders are wrong about the reasons for their success. Trader A might think his success is due to his fancy computers and sophisticated algorithms when in reality his success is due to his having a solid foundation and good operational execution.

Trading well is not easy, but it is something you can learn if you have the perseverance combined with the humility to be realistic about your own strengths and weaknesses
For the most part, professional traders, syndicate traders, and the specialists, do not look at these things. They simply do not have the time. Professionals have to act swiftly, as soon as market conditions change, because they are up against other professionals who will act immediately against their interests if they are too slow in reacting to the market. The only way they can respond that fast is to understand and react, almost instinctively, to what the market is telling them. They read the market through volume and its relationship to price action[If you do find a colleague who is consistently correct, either learn his system so that you can use his tools with your own intuition and experience or delegate part of your trading strategy development to him.]To play the market properly requires silence, and seclusion to examine the situation, and to appraise, and deliberate on new information that comes to hand during the trading day. One must always have a clear strategy to play the market and clear rules to follow.
at least with regarding making decisions. If you can put aside what should be, what could be, what ought to be, what would have, could have, should have occurred, and just pay attention to what is actually happening, the act of paying attention transforms what is. The greatest action, the wisest, the best action that you can take in almost any situation is to stay with what is, instead of jumping to conclusions or trying to come up with conclusions.

I think one mistake novice traders make is that they begin trading before they have any real idea what they are doing. They are active, but they are not accomplishing anything. I hardly spend any time trading. Over 99 percent of my time is spent on the computer, doing research.
1]What markets are you going to trade? You need to select a market that fits your personality because a market is reflection of the people who trade it.
2)What is your trading capitalization? On the one hand, you should honestly be able to say, "If I lose all this money, won't change my lifestyle." On the other hand, you need a large enough account so that making at least as much as you do from your current job is a feasible goal. Otherwise, you will think that you are a failure because you will work harder as a trader than you do at the job you are in now.
3)How will orders be entered? Will you scale into positions or put them on all at once? How will you exit losing trades? How will you exit winning trades?What type of drawdown will cause you to stop trading and reevaluate your approach? What type of drawdown will cause you to shut down trading?
4)What are your profit goals, measured on as short a time frame as is feasible for your trading approach?
5)What procedure will you use for analyzing your trades?
6)What will you do if personal problems arise that could adversely impact your trading?
7)How will you set up your working environment so that it is conducive to trading and maximizes your chances for success

People underestimate the time it takes to succeed as a trader. Some people come here and think they can sit with me for a week and become great traders. How many people when they went to college would've thought to walk up to the professor and say, "I know the course is for a semester, but I think a week should be enough for me to get it." Gaining proficiency is the same in trading as in any other profession—it requires experience, and experience takes time. A man few years ago asked me, "How long will it take me to become a professional trader so 1 can quit my job and support my family?"
"Three to five years," I said.
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"It is the very foundation of strategy to be able to adapt to any situation and continue fighting without losing heart. You gain this ability by practicing day in and day out with intensity." --Miyamoto Musashi

Just so a chart of the averages, or of a single stock, reflects the ideas, hopes, ambitions and purposes of the mass mind operating in the market, or of a manipulator handling a single stock. But when a student undertakes to read from his charts the purposes and objective of those who are responsible for a stock's action in the market, he is beginning to see, in a true light, the meaning of scientific stock speculation
As traders, we cannot afford the luxury of wishing and hoping because it puts us in a passive relationship with the markets. When we wish and hope, we are shifting responsibility on to the markets for making something happen instead of confronting the conditions and doing something about it ourselves. If we find ourselves wishing and hoping, it is an excellent indication that we don't know what is going on and as a result need to get out of the markets until we do.
The movement of price in any and all free markets is a function of the laws of pure supply and demand. Buying and selling opportunity emerges when this simple and straight forward relationship is out of balance.

"It is very important to visualize the many ways in which the market may unfold, rather than trying to forcast or predict how it will unfold. With a market understanding, you can begin to visualize each possibilitySuccessful real-time traders have a far better chance of taking their successful trading techniques and applying them to automated trading systems .

kudos to cv,
 

oilman5

Well-Known Member
for the benefit of all traderji.com forum member.
1. why successful traders r superior ?
ans. they are superior by experience and rationality.THEY JUST HAVE BETTER CONTROL OVER THEIR EMOTIONS AND ARE DISCIPLINES.they have better execution skill .
2. what time frame they trade?
ans. as they found which suit them with comfort and making money.
3. how far they r subjective in trading ?
ans. no subjectvity.as per system ..entry -exit condition r predefined.however
some sentimental condition r checked.
4. what r the reason for their actual consistency ?
ans.right plan and implementation.improving success rate.
5. on what condition they dont trade ?
ans. condition not suiting their plan. when r/r ratio not favourable.
6. what is their contingency plan[enough is enough..now i am booking loss]?
ans. inbuild in the system.[hence nothing to worry]

7. what self sabotage u find most difficult to overcome..yet how u have done it ?
ans.not following the plan.distract by others openion...soln . follow price in a disciplined way.
8. do u think beginner trader[4yr amateur] can be like u oneday ?if yes. HOW!

ans. yes . discipline and a solid implemention plan including slippage.understand market and good money management.[ignore media]
 

oilman5

Well-Known Member
so we clearly see some difference betn pro and serious amateur.
no1. level of comfort and serenity.
no2. least subjective.
no3.worst scenario is already planned and mastery over implemention.
key word is discipline and practicing their tool.
so from beginner u r moving on top............
so we find out the tools.....it is the system.
no real pro shall give u. though in trading system of beginner'....many a real tool r given for which i paid a lot.[to buy them]
tool is indicator..nothing but actual condition to initiate and close the trade. system is all those condition written ,taking care of exception.
scanner is software based predefined search condition.
filter is for keeping the best probable one for trade.
system testing is to build up confidence..and to bring rationality.

further elaborating the tools
..............................................
for intraday..its nothing but orderflow....price higher high break out concept.

for eod....predefined scanner.[u have to decide what u want]
for shortterm...support buy..
oversold condition...now price just starts to reverse.
[ suitable indicator signal which u rely]
for position play...some news impact not yet discounted in price.
continuty of trend in price[ma based]
something to check strength.
IMP: MINIMISING SUBJECTIVITY AND MEDIA HULLABULLA..IS UR JOB.
NEVER BELIEVE IN VALUE BUY AS A TRADER.NEVER FORGET STOPLOSS.
........................................
Originally Posted by oilman5

i dont know,whether i am right to write here....forbidden art of trading will be exposed here.many a pro r available here in this great forum...i request them to make comments.
1. why they r superior ?

There is nobody superior or inferior as far as markets are concerned.......and the time you do feel that you are superior,that will be when the market cuts you down to size.


Quote:
2. what time frame they trade?

Intradays and position trading.......love playing the weekly as well as the 5min charts.


Quote:
3. how far they r subjective in trading ?

Used to love words like "subjective","mystical","intuition" once upon a time.......nowadays,the attitude is more to objectification of the whole process.Do whatever it takes,an automated system,or set points of entry,exit and the discipline to always follow the rules of your trading plan.Whatever........but one cannot beat all this fear and greed and hope,by joining the crowd.One therefore stands aside,follows the rules,practically robotic,day after day.


Quote:
4. what r the reasons for their actual consistency ?

A trading plan of attack,and then the discipline to follow it to the tee.



Quote:
5. on what condition they dont trade ?

There are many,like achieving the targets and more for the month.Also not trading if taking a hit and a predefined percentage point is hit.Or if there is some sort of family emergency......etc etc.

Of course,importantly,when I have a rip roaring,rollicking bullish 60min,I do NOT trade the 5min and stupidly go short.There is enough profits to be made just following the trend of the 60min and trading the 5.


Quote:
6. what is their contingency plan[enough is enough..now i am booking loss

Hmm.......stop loss for every trade.Position sizing appropriately.Set Risk percent per trade.Monitoring average wins,losses,drawdowns......blah blahblah,think that what everybody here already knows.


Quote:
7. what self sabotage u find most difficult to overcome..yet how u have done it ?

Anticipating a move before it happens,trying to get in even before your trading strategy says so.........got licked many times doing that.But not too much of a problem these days .........now in only when the move happens.



Quote:
8. do u think beginner trader[4yr amateur] can be like u oneday ?if yes. HOW!

Any fool can be a trader,every beginner trader can one day become an experienced one.Every trader with a plan and strategy that works can make money off the markets.Why then are 99% people failing at the markets?They go by what a newsletter,a self proclaimed guru,their broker,etc tells them to do.They go by their gut feel,or their neighbour's gut feel.They believe that making money is an evil act.They believe that trading the markets is for spare change .They have yet to educate themselves.They have no plan,no modus operandi,no strategy,no plan of attack...............

Approach trading like a business,have a business plan,a trading plan.We are in this to make money and lots of it,as in any business.But strangely,to make lots of money,you have to shift the mind's focus from making money to putting in that perfect trade.Although it's one and the same,you have to maintain focus on the trades.

Everything is cold,calculated strategy and then a disciplined implementation.We are in this to capitalise on other people's fear and other people's greed.......and for that,your own mind cannot work in the process of fear and greed.It has to be quiet.In the present moment.Practically like meditation.

Can anybody and everybody do it?Of course,provided you do all what it takes to be a trader.But sadly,that will never be the case........99% will always lose,not because it's difficult,but because these 99% will not approach it with a plan,with the required discipline.........That stat will always remain.

Can you be that 1%?Surely and definitely,provided you are willing to pay time and energy and focus to making yourself a great trader.
 

oilman5

Well-Known Member
Your mind is a chart and your memory is a terminal and your strategy is your dealer who will push the target through”
You can take those numbers home all you have to do is be quick and leave the greed
..............................
lack of knowledge with this comes two things :

Why it is happening
when it is going to happen.

2)Exiting when you are not supposed to exit and entering when you are not required to enter in a particular stock.

3)Counting on blessings and prayers if you are in this category believe me you trying to jump from a hill without any safety rope
 

oilman5

Well-Known Member
shall i show a tool?let us come to the point.

In order to succeed at trading, you must have an edge. Your edge begins with the knowledge you gain through your research and testing that a particular price pattern or market behavior offers a level of predictability and a risk to reward ratio that provides a consistently profitable outcome over time. Without it, one is just "playing" the market in order to have something to talk about on message boards. To get it, you have to know exactly what you're looking for and what to do with it once you've found it. This process is what the journal is all about.

The journal goes through several stages depending on where you are. Once you've decided where you want to concentrate your efforts (at this level, the journal may resemble a diary), then you begin the process of developing a system (or method, strategy, procedure, whatever you want to call it). Here the journal takes on a different character. Once you've developed a tentative/preliminary system, you begin testing/trading it, and the journal adopts a still different character.

The first step is to decide what kind of trader you want to be.

* What do you want to accomplish with your trading? Is it recreational? Supplementary income? A part-time job? Do you want to make a living at it? Even the greenest of the green knows whether or not he wants to make a living at it, trade only part time, trade for recreation, trade for the action, trade to have something to talk about with other traders (for whatever reason), trade only long enough to earn money to do or buy X.

* Do you have any idea what sort of trading is most comfortable? Long or intermediate-term trading? Short-term trading? Day-trading? Trend-trading? Scalping? (Note here that a short-term trader, for example, does not become a long-term trader just because his stop was hit and he didn't sell; a long-term trader doesn't become a short-term trader because he chickened out and sold too soon. Each of these approaches are selected deliberately and for thoroughly-considered reasons.) How patient are you? How adventurous? Are you a leader or a follower (most people think they're leaders)?
The second step is to decide what you're going to trade and when you're going to trade it.

* Have you found an instrument -- futures, stocks, ETFs, bonds, options -- that provides you with the range and volatility you require but also the safety that enables you to relax and trade in an objective and rational manner?

* Have you yet found a time (5m, hourly, weekly) or tick (1t, 200t) or volume (1K, 100K) interval that gives you enough trading opportunities but also gives you enough time to think about what you're doing? If you want to limit your trading to the "morning", are you physically and psychologically prepared to trade all day? If not, can you shrug off whatever opportunities you may miss by limiting the amount of time you spend trading?

The third step is to develop your system*.

A system consists of (a) a set of rules that you use to select profitable positions and (b) a set of rules that you use to manage the trade once you're in it. (*Note: again, whether you call it a system, a method, a strategy, a plan, a scheme, an approach, a procedure, or a modus operandi is not as important as sitting down and doing it.)

* Developing a system begins with deciding just what it is you're looking for. Therefore, begin by studying price movement in real time (or at the end of the day through "replay", if your charting program offers it). By "study", I mean to observe it with intent, not just read about it or listen to somebody talk about it. Note the conditions under which price rises, falls, drifts. Make every effort to avoid imposing your biases onto what you observe. You may see trading as a war, a competition, a game, or a puzzle. You may think you're out to kill somebody, outwit somebody, or are out only to detect the flow and slip into it, riding the waves as if you were sailing. None of this should be allowed to affect what you observe.

* Develop a set of preliminary hypotheses which exploit the profit opportunities presented by these movements, e.g. price began trending "here". Price broke out "there". Price reversed "there". What can I do to take advantage of that? What do I have to look for?

* Decide what strategy will best take advantage of what you think you've found. Are you looking to catch a reversal in the hopes that it will become a trend? Or are you looking to trade series of reversals within the day's or week's range? Or do you prefer to wait for a breakout and trade what may become a trend? Or would you rather wait for a retracement in what may be shaping up to be a trend? Limit yourself to only one strategy at the beginning.

Carefully define the setup which implements this strategy, preferably using old charts (attempting to define the setup by studying realtime charts is inefficient since you don't yet know what it is that you're looking for). This is called "backtesting". All else flows from this. Unless you know what you're looking for, you cannot test it, much less screen for it. If you have not tested it, you have no idea of the probability of its success. With no idea of the probability of success, any trades made are essentially guesses.

Therefore, focus on the setup. One setup. Determine its characteristics. Define it so specifically and so thoroughly that you can recognize it without any doubt whatsoever in real time. Decide provisionally where best to enter, what the target ought to be, where the stop should be placed, and so on. Only after the setup is defined and tested (and it can't, ipso facto, be tested until it's been defined) can one even begin to think about trading it with real money, much less trading multiple setups. Attempting to shortcut this process merely expands the amount of time it will take to develop the necessary skills. Nothing is gained by painting the house before scraping it, cleaning it, and priming it since you'll have to do it all over again sooner rather than later.

* Forward-test what you have so far, again using old charts, preferably replaying them (if replay is not available to you, then scroll through them, bar by bar). In other words, "pre-test" the setup. Make whatever modifications are necessary to the setup, i.e., re-examine and re-define your strategy. Address risk management, trade management, money management in further detail. Determine the ratio of winning trades to losing trades (you will, of course, have to define "winner" and "loser", which is where risk management and trade management come in). Determine the ratio of profit to loss. Determine the maximum loss. Determine the maximum number of consecutive losers.


Note that beginners often use "win/loss" to combine two separate considerations into one, and failing to keep them separate can create problems. One is win:lose. The other is profit:loss. Between the two, the "lose" and the "loss" have two distinct meanings. Win:lose refers to the ratio of winning trades to losing trades. Profit:loss means, expectedly, the ratio of profit to loss.
You'll read that the % of winners can be less than the % of losers as long as the winners are sufficiently profitable, one's management is superior, etc. And, yes, theoretically, one can "win" less than 50% of the time if his profits sufficiently outweigh his losses. But if your real-time real-money test begins with a string of the losses anticipated by your backtest, you'll be out of the game almost before it begins. In fact, one can be left high and dry even if his % of wins outnumber his % of losses, as mentioned above, if there is insufficient control of the amount of loss OR if the losses occur in sufficiently high numbers at the beginning of the trial.Then there are commissions and assorted trading costs to take into account, which is why traders who actually trade find that, without size, all the postulations about percentage don't mean much in practice.
* Paper-trade this plan, in a simulated environment, as a semi-final test, until you are satisfied that it performs at least as well as it did during the previous testing phase. This may take several months or more depending on how many trials you perform. If your plan is not consistently profitable, go back however many steps are necessary to arrive at a potential solution. (See also Making High Probability Trades.)

* Trade the plan using real money in real time, spending only what is absolutely necessary on "tools" and trading the minimum number of shares, contracts, etc., allowable. If your plan is not consistently profitable, go back .however many steps are necessary to arrive at a potential solution. Recalculate your win rate and profit:loss ratio on a continuing basis.

* If your plan is consistently profitable in practice, increase your size to what is a comfortable level, maintaining a continuous loop of re-appraisal and re-evaluation. When things come unglued, back up as far as necessary to regain your footing.


Novices rarely do any of this. They borrow something from somebody or somewhere and perhaps modify it somewhat, but they rarely go through the defining and testing process themselves. Some just try whatever seems like a good idea and hope for the best.

If one has absolutely no idea where to begin, there is nothing wrong with using a canned strategy IF it is used only as a point of departure. In other words, the canned strategy, regardless of what it is or what claims are made for it, still has to be tested, which often entails taking what is unexpectedly vague to begin with and defining it to a level of specificity that enables the testing to take place (it should come as no surprise that those who do go through the process succeed and those who don't, struggle, often to the point of being driven out of the market). Examples of canned strategies that are reasonably well-defined include the Darvas Box, the Ross Hook, the Opening Range Breakout, O'Neil's Cup With Handle, Dunnigan's One-Way Formula. Some of these are more vague than others and will require considerable work on definition before they can be tested. But they serve as points of departure
A journal should be more than just a trading log – bought here, sold there, made this, lost that. It should be a record of your journey (that's why it's called a "journal"). If done correctly, a journal will reveal patterns. Patterns of what you're doing right and what you're doing wrong and when and how often and under what circumstances. Patterns of the behaviors of those who are trading your stock (bond, fund, option, whatever). Patterns of the market you're trading, of its cycles, of its stages, of what works at some stages and in some cycles and not in others. It will reveal much regarding your trading. It will also reveal much regarding your self.

Addressing the questions asked in Part One and defining and testing the setup are only the preliminaries. Eventually, one starts trading, if only on paper, and that is where the journal can make the difference between success and failure.

A journal is not just a record. It is also a plan. Before the first trade is ever made, even if only on paper, prepare for the day. Note any events that you should be aware of (reports, press releases, meetings, speeches, testimony, nuclear explosions, approaching meteors, etc). Write down reminders of any elements of the trading plan that you're having trouble with and what you intend to do about them, e.g., “don’t take any trades anywhere but at support or resistance” or “be wary of wide-range bars” (this may be necessary as early as the afternoon of the first day).

Above all, record your justification for each and every trade. Record your thoughts before, during, and after the trade, written in real time* (your perception of what looks to you like a potential setup will change substantially after the “setup” resolves itself, and when you ask, later, “what the hell was I thinking?”, your record of your thoughts -- your "self-talk" -- will tell you, so that the next time, in real time, you’ll have a deeper and more rational perspective). This is more than just the reason for the trade (“It looked like it was going to go up”). It is more than the rationalization (“It was time for it to go up”). It is more than the mystic prompt ("I felt it was going to go up"). It’s the justification for it, the explanation that one would provide to one’s boss or client if he were trading for someone else. If everyone wrote down the reasons behind and justifications for every trade, their learning curves would be accelerated dramatically.

*

At the end of the day, review your decisions. Did you make good trading decisions, i.e., did you follow your rules or not? If you followed your rules but made one or more losing trades anyway, do any of your rules need to be re-examined? If you didn’t follow one or more rules, which do you most often fail to follow? What’s the problem? What did you say to yourself at the time? What do you need to work on the following day? Always, what could you have done differently to improve the outcome? Can it be tested to find out if it's only an occasional anomaly or worth incorporating into the system?

And then you write down your detailed plan for the next day . . .

Everywhere there are people telling us that this path or that path is the one we should take. How are we to decide? Most of us end up stumbling along through a trial and error exploration of various systems, methods, techniques, and whatnot. Some of us find something that works. A great many do not, and quit in frustration, or broke. (John Forman)

Make journals a part of the daily routine – Even if you don’t trade on a particular day, it is valuable to review the day’s setups and behavior at key price levels. Reviewing patterns on different time frames can also help traders internalize the context of the markets they are trading, as well as the interrelationships among those markets. The French scientist Louis Pasteur observed that, in matters of observation, “chance only favors prepared minds”. Replaying market days, reviewing your own performance, and identifying missed opportunities prepares you for future performance, as your increasing familiarity with trading patterns sensitizes you to them in real time.

Incorporate specifics in your journals – If I had to identify the single most common shortcoming among trading journals, it would be their absence of detail. Entries such as, “I lost my discipline; I have to be more patient,” might be nice as post-it reminders, but are inadequate as journal entries. Journals need to clearly state what happened, your assessment of why it happened, and the specific steps you intend to take to deal with the situation in the future. A good rule is that anyone reading your journal should be able to identify and follow the exact same steps that you intend to take in the future. Your journal should be a planning document, not a statement of intentions.

Wherever possible, review your journal entries with a valued colleague or mentor – When I established a training program for new traders, one of my first steps was to insist upon daily review of trading journals. This required me to create a trusting and constructive environment, so that traders would be honest in their entries. Once that openness developed, the daily reviews became proactive planning sessions (usually shortly before the start of the trading day) that addressed issues before they could damage the profit/loss statement. Even more important, the daily review created expectations of accountability, as traders knew that my inevitable question would be, “How did you do with your goals for the day
Use journals to review positive trading performance, as well as problems – The number two shortcoming among journals is their focus on problems to the exclusion of solutions. If journals become a mere recounting of one’s flaws and inadequacies, traders will inevitably lose interest in them. Traders can learn as much from what they do right as from their errors. My favorite instruction to new traders is to highlight in their journals one thing that they did right the previous day that they want to replicate today and one thing that they could improve upon in today’s trading. This forces traders to stay in touch with their strengths, as well as their failings.

Each journal entry should include material about the markets and material about the trader – It is not unusual for traders to emphasize one at the expense of the other. The core concept I stress with traders is that of pattern recognition. Traders display patterns in their behaviors: some of these are positive; others interfere with profitability. Markets enact their patterns as well; it is the trader who can see these as they emerge and act quickly that has the best chance of long-term success. Including material about trading patterns and traders’ patterns makes the journal a learning tool about oneself and the markets

TRADING PERFORMANCE
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VISUALISE..A chess player analyzing the board for the next move...
Trading as a Performance Activity.Humans choose when to take action and when to refrain; they can select various courses of action on different occasions and can invent new strategies when needed. performance is a function of the chosen actions of performers, the correctness of those choices, and the skill with which the actions are carried out. Activities that are performed well on a consistent basis require a high degree of skill. A lucky outcome is exception.There are individuals who can be identified as expert performers. With very rare exception, expert performers are ones who have developed their talents over time. Most expert performers undergo specialized training to cultivate their talents.

They require a specialized knowledge base. To perform well in a field, a person must master the information and skills specific to that field.
Trading, as a performance activity, has much in common with chess. It is competitive, requiring a high degree of concentration and strategy. It also features a limited number of actions that, in combination, create a large array of possible strategies and actions. This makes both activities easy to learn, but difficult to master. Chess can be played in lightning fashion, with very little time between moves, or it can allow players many minutes to plan moves—or even days (postal chess). Trading can also be conducted on a very short-term basis or can be planned and executed over hours or days. These similarities make chess an excellent starting point for examining the performance dynamics of trading, especially since chess is one of the performance fields most studied by researchers.A well-replicated finding in chess research is that the memory processes of experts are different from those of non-experts. One intriguing set of studies took chessboard arrangements from a past tournament games and briefly showed them to expert players and novices. Afterward, the expert chess players were able to recall the positions of many more pieces than the novices. When the two groups were shown chessboards with randomly arranged pieces, however, their recall of the positions of the pieces was quite limited. The researchers’ conclusion was that experts do not have better memories than non-experts; rather, they have better memories for meaningful relationships among chess pieces. Instead of remembering where each individual piece was on the board, the experts viewed the board as clusters of pieces and remembered these. When the board was randomly arranged, there were no meaningful clusters of pieces and the experts had no effective means for encoding their information.

How do expert chess players gain this ability to perceive meaningful patterns among pieces? Because chess players are given ratings based upon their tournament play, it is relatively easy to compare experts (masters and grandmasters) with less accomplished players. When a variety of factors are incorporated into multiple regression equations to predict chess ratings, two stand out as highly significant:The number of books owned and The cumulative number of hours spent in practice correlation between the amount of time spent in practice and current performance ratings was .60
it is necessary to understand what chess books are and how they are used. These texts typically break the game down into components (opening, endgame, defenses, etc.) and present historical games from tournaments, along with annotation from an expert author. Readers do not merely skim over these games; they learn specific opening or defensive sequences and then see how these were utilized in actual games. They recreate those games on their own boards and carefully play through the positions, so that they can see what the expert players saw. They also play through alternate sequences to observe where these might lead.

Interestingly, chess experts do not have significantly more chess-playing experience than non-experts. Rather, a higher percentage of the experience of experts is spent in the systematic practice of various facets of the game. Non-experts tend to spend a higher proportion of their time in games against similarly-skilled opponents. This experience neither exposes the learner to the moves of experts, nor does it provide time for a careful review of moves, exploration of alternate lines, etc. In the Charness work, the correlation between solitary practice and chess ratings is almost twice as high as the correlation between practice with others and ratings. This is because solitary practice with chess books allows learners to obtain chess knowledge in context. Instead of focusing on the moves of an opponent, learners encounter—again and again—those meaningful configurations of pieces that appear in the games of experts
Because of this, chess students can create and play through almost any challenging situation imaginable, drawing upon the accumulated wisdom of experts. Trading possesses no such database. Trading books, unlike chess texts, are not annotated compilations of the trading decisions of objectively rated experts. One cannot use trading books to recreate trading sessions or to systematically explore trading decisions and their alternatives.As a result, traders tend to spend little time in the systematic practice that is the single greatest predictor of chess expertise.REMEMBER...In every performance field, the development and maintenance of expertise requires a high ratio of time spent in practice relative to time spent in actual performance.Athletes spend far more time working out, practicing, and scrimmaging than actually playing in competitive events.Only significant time spent in absorbing winning and losing chess enables players to internalize the patterns of play that distinguish experts from non-experts. The trader who spends more time to learn,observe and practice..definitely is superior.The expert trader needs to be able to review and re-experience markets and systematically rehearse facets of trading performance: entering, managing, and exiting positions.Think of each trading session as a chess game, and each game as a contest between two expert players named “Bull” and “Bear”. Every short-term swing in the market is a move by Bull or Bear that ultimately leads either to a victory for one of them or a draw. In tracking the moves of Bull and Bear, we can pause the match at any point and observe how each player exploits the weak moves of the other. With the aid of an electronic database that collates similar trading sessions, we can even explore how alternate moves by each side produce different outcomes. Moreover, we can play and replay the “games” (and their similar variants), seeing if our simulated trading decisions accurately reflect our reading of the strengths and weaknesses of the players’ positions.

How could we practice this?Programs that allow users to save and replay tick data are especially valuable, as this creates a library of trading sessions akin to the collections of chess games found in books... general rules and advice do not turn chess novices into experts, and there is no reason to believe they will advance the performance curve for traders. Knowledge and practice—and especially the direct experience of knowledge-in-practice—are the keys to the acquisition of expertise.so now we know why most socalled traders fail.. they have failed to structure their learning to facilitate expertise.
they fail to put systematic work into performance....HENCE LEARN DYNAMIC TRADING CONCEPT..AND IMPLEMENT IT.
with regards to all
[OILMAN5..A KNOWN TRADE ADDICT , AN EX.NATIONAL CHESS PLAYER

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hi, here i am putting a trade sheet. as i am computer novice, ask help to convert in xcel sheet..and then copy paste a link here for all.
trade sheet
...................
column
no heading
1 dt
2 name of stock
3 type of trade..buy/sell
4. trade set up condition..gap/ volume spike/support pt
result out/ commodity price up
5. entry condition ..pull back/ break out/ continuation
6. money alloted ..no of stock x price
7. style of trade ..day/ short term / inter mediate
8. present value of nifty
9. any hype at present...
10. stop loss
11. profit booking strategy ....1.................2
12. profit target.. p1............p2

13. additional buy strategy/ with reason
14. sell dt and NIFTY VALUE

15. sell quantity x sell price..
16. whether trade is profit...howmuch
17. whether trade is loss.. howmuch
18. have u followed stop and SAR. IF NOT WHY
19. reason of sell
20. cost of trade[ comission+ tax]
21. your net profit
22. your monthly rate of return..

2nd sheet ..monthly performance sheet
.................................................. ...

column description

1 month
2 total no of trade in month
3. no of winning trade
4. total amount of winning
5. no of lossing trade
6. total amount of losing
7. net profit/ loss in a month
8. is losing trade shown some pattern failure/
wrong assumption
9. av. win amount per trade per lakh
10. increase of your equity value..
11. percentage of wrong trade
12. risk amount in each trade. value ..in %
13. drawdown condition to quit
14. monthly yield compare to nifty yield in month

note.. its best if u plot this equity curve
 
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