Raj232

Well-Known Member
Hello @msmee and @Raj232 ,
But what if the execution fails as a result of order modification errors/delays due to bandwidth? For us, getting it right is the first priority. Also, being levied 20 rupees a few times shouldn't be an issue if you ask me. Why? There's a lot of work & investment that goes into making this possible.

Hope this clarifies.
@Tejas Khoday : Yes, you have made a very valid point. Thanks for the info !!
 

sach007

Impatient Trader
Hi @Tejas Khoday

I recently opened an account with FYERS. So far so good. However, two queries:

i) is there an option to view market by price data, especially ATP & OI for a scrip in Fyers Web platform? Alternatively, is DOM available in Fyers ONE?

ii) it seems you are charging higher brokerage on the squareoff side of bracket orders. I already have a support ticket on this but no response received. The issue seems, if lets say i have a multi lot buy bracket order(lets say 10lots) and it gets filled in batches (say 5lots, 3lots and 2 lots), then there are 3 squareoff/stoploss orders generated (logical) and brokerage charged for three, which seems odd as i placed only one order and expect to be charged brokerage for only 2 trades, no matter what fill i got. Could you please look into it.

thanks.
Oh is it ... I have to check.. thanks for your observation sharing.
 

sach007

Impatient Trader


Hello @msmee and @Raj232 ,

1. Fyers Web is simple and focused on order execution, the accuracy of data & charting at the moment. No, we haven't added a whole lot of other features because we want to keep it simple. Not many have asked for more features as yet. We're not averse to introducing new features but just more cautious with what we introduce on it. We don't want to overload it like Fyers One in the near future at least.

2. We don't charge higher! You are totally misinformed. If bracket orders are sliced while being executed, then they get charged as separate executed orders. This is a standard across brokerages. Just ask anyone who uses NEST or Omnesys based trading platforms with any other broker.

Other brokers may not tell you how bracket orders really work because they may not be aware of the intricacies of how the order is exactly managed in the back-end involving the exchange. But for everyone's knowledge and to clear your doubts, I will tell you how bracket orders work & why you can get charged more if your Bracket Order has been executed in parts.

A. The client places an order to buy 2 Quantities of XYZ at ₹100 with a Target of 105 & SL of 98.
B. This order is received by the broker and is sent to the exchange for execution (Leg-1).
C. The order is partially executed as only 1 quantity is purchased at ₹100. Since Leg-1 is partially executed, the broker's platform then places a target order at 105 & SL at 98 for that 1 quantity. These orders are placed in the exchange's order book.
D. After some time, the pending quantity of 1 gets executed too. The brokerage platform then places a new Target order at 105 and SL at 98. So now, there are multiple orders Targets & SLs on the exchange order book.
E. Let's say your target is hit at 105. In this case, since your order was entered in 2 parts, we had to place 2 target orders too. So in this case, when the price hits 105, your orders will get executed in the way it was entered. The orders are not modified for your own safety and to prevent any failures arising out modification errors.

View attachment 34064

The image above shows the interaction between the Client, Broker & Exchange. The reason I have mentioned it is to help you understand what is exactly happens during a bracket order execution. Please understand that in bracket order, execution is the most important part. If a broker tries to modify an existing order, then your brokerage will be <20. But what if the execution fails as a result of order modification errors/delays due to bandwidth? For us, getting it right is the first priority. Also, being levied 20 rupees a few times shouldn't be an issue if you ask me. Why? There's a lot of work & investment that goes into making this possible.

Hope this clarifies.

Thanks for clearly explaining all...
 


Hello @msmee and @Raj232 ,

1. Fyers Web is simple and focused on order execution, the accuracy of data & charting at the moment. No, we haven't added a whole lot of other features because we want to keep it simple. Not many have asked for more features as yet. We're not averse to introducing new features but just more cautious with what we introduce on it. We don't want to overload it like Fyers One in the near future at least.

2. We don't charge higher! You are totally misinformed. If bracket orders are sliced while being executed, then they get charged as separate executed orders. This is a standard across brokerages. Just ask anyone who uses NEST or Omnesys based trading platforms with any other broker.

Other brokers may not tell you how bracket orders really work because they may not be aware of the intricacies of how the order is exactly managed in the back-end involving the exchange. But for everyone's knowledge and to clear your doubts, I will tell you how bracket orders work & why you can get charged more if your Bracket Order has been executed in parts.

A. The client places an order to buy 2 Quantities of XYZ at ₹100 with a Target of 105 & SL of 98.
B. This order is received by the broker and is sent to the exchange for execution (Leg-1).
C. The order is partially executed as only 1 quantity is purchased at ₹100. Since Leg-1 is partially executed, the broker's platform then places a target order at 105 & SL at 98 for that 1 quantity. These orders are placed in the exchange's order book.
D. After some time, the pending quantity of 1 gets executed too. The brokerage platform then places a new Target order at 105 and SL at 98. So now, there are multiple orders Targets & SLs on the exchange order book.
E. Let's say your target is hit at 105. In this case, since your order was entered in 2 parts, we had to place 2 target orders too. So in this case, when the price hits 105, your orders will get executed in the way it was entered. The orders are not modified for your own safety and to prevent any failures arising out modification errors.

View attachment 34064

The image above shows the interaction between the Client, Broker & Exchange. The reason I have mentioned it is to help you understand what is exactly happens during a bracket order execution. Please understand that in bracket order, execution is the most important part. If a broker tries to modify an existing order, then your brokerage will be <20. But what if the execution fails as a result of order modification errors/delays due to bandwidth? For us, getting it right is the first priority. Also, being levied 20 rupees a few times shouldn't be an issue if you ask me. Why? There's a lot of work & investment that goes into making this possible.

Hope this clarifies.
Thanks for the detailed explanation. However, don't you think the risk of modifying an existing order and the risk of putting through a new order is rather equivalent?

Maybe you could give an option to convert executed intraday orders to BO so that the complexity/brokerage is reduced whereas the inherent risk management & higher leverage of BO is also available to clients.

Also, as you mentioned Fyers One is fully loaded, then why is there no vertical price ladder (one of your unique features) available in Fyers One or am i missing the menu item?

Regards.
 

Tejas Khoday

Co-Founder & CEO, FYERS
Thanks for the detailed explanation. However, don't you think the risk of modifying an existing order and the risk of putting through a new order is rather equivalent?

Maybe you could give an option to convert executed intraday orders to BO so that the complexity/brokerage is reduced whereas the inherent risk management & higher leverage of BO is also available to clients.

Also, as you mentioned Fyers One is fully loaded, then why is there no vertical price ladder (one of your unique features) available in Fyers One or am i missing the menu item?

Regards.
1. No, the risk is definitely not equivalent. It is very easy to think so. If an order execution fails, then your reaction would be rather different. Don't you think? It's best to have safe practices while designing a product and making sure that the room for error is reduced as much as possible.

2. @msmee, I am sorry but your suggestion cannot be implemented. You will have to decide beforehand if you want your order to be INTRADAY or BO. Converting it is not feasible from a technical standpoint.

3. Because each platform has its pros & cons. Name one platform which has everything!

A kind request to be rational. We're trying to do our best for you and all clients.