Expert Advice Needed - Naked Option Selling

rajputz

Well-Known Member
#1
Hi,

I need advice on how I can protect naked option selling in extreme conditions.

1. I tend to sell deep out of the money options on second last Thursday or day before that to give only 6 7 days till expiry.

2. I look for stocks that have rallied the month and are touching the resistance levels second or 3rd time. For eg. I sold Apollo tyres 245 calls at 1.5 only 1 lot. It was 230 when I sold.

3. Most of the times the option expires worthless. But sometimes like in todays case, apollo tyres is testing new heights. It can continue to gain or it can fall. That's a chance that I don't want to take.

Is there anything creative I can do at the moment with options right now so that I can be in profit on Thursday in whatever scenario.

I thought of purchasing 240 Call 1 lot. But it turned out that if the stock closes below 240, I will be in loss. If it closes above 245, I will be in profit. So that's my confusion. Open Interest on Apollo tyres 240 call suggests that it wont go beyond it.

But is there anyway, I can take this situation more in my control.

Simply Put, What could an expert option trader might have done as there can be gap up tomorrow because of the buildup today. How would an option trader turned this into a profitable trade.
 

travi

Well-Known Member
#2
Hi,

I need advice on how I can protect naked option selling in extreme conditions.

1. I tend to sell deep out of the money options on second last Thursday or day before that to give only 6 7 days till expiry.

2. I look for stocks that have rallied the month and are touching the resistance levels second or 3rd time. For eg. I sold Apollo tyres 245 calls at 1.5 only 1 lot. It was 230 when I sold.

3. Most of the times the option expires worthless. But sometimes like in todays case, apollo tyres is testing new heights. It can continue to gain or it can fall. That's a chance that I don't want to take.

Is there anything creative I can do at the moment with options right now so that I can be in profit on Thursday in whatever scenario.

I thought of purchasing 240 Call 1 lot. But it turned out that if the stock closes below 240, I will be in loss. If it closes above 245, I will be in profit. So that's my confusion. Open Interest on Apollo tyres 240 call suggests that it wont go beyond it.

But is there anyway, I can take this situation more in my control.

Simply Put, What could an expert option trader might have done as there can be gap up tomorrow because of the buildup today. How would an option trader turned this into a profitable trade.
You mean the position is trading at 6.45 and you originally sold it for 1.5?
So ur taking a loss of Inr 5 ?
and expiry is for 27-APR?

I don't track Apollo Tyres so I can't give you a fix-it-all glue type answer.
Do you expect the price to go up and till what strike until Expiry?
 

rajputz

Well-Known Member
#3
You mean the position is trading at 6.45 and you originally sold it for 1.5?
So ur taking a loss of Inr 5 ?
and expiry is for 27-APR?
Its at 3.4

But i dont want it to control me...

Point is how to control this situation
 

Subhadip

Well-Known Member
#4
You mean the position is trading at 6.45 and you originally sold it for 1.5?
So ur taking a loss of Inr 5 ?
and expiry is for 27-APR?

I don't track Apollo Tyres so I can't give you a fix-it-all glue type answer.
Do you expect the price to go up and till what strike until Expiry?
Also as per chart I am seeing a big upmove.
 

rajputz

Well-Known Member
#6
Buy deep in the money call
It has already rallied from 180 to 240...thats 30 percent this month...How can everyone say that huge upmovie. My expiry is April.

Max OI buildup is on 240 CE for now.

I am considering squaring off 243 CE at 3.5 and Selling 240 PE.

if I buy CE of 240 at CMP then also I will be having max pain if price remains at 245. Anywhere above 245 will be beneficial.
 

travi

Well-Known Member
#7
It has already rallied from 180 to 240...thats 30 percent this month...How can everyone say that huge upmovie. My expiry is April.

Max OI buildup is on 240 CE for now.

I am considering squaring off 243 CE at 3.5 and Selling 240 PE.

if I buy CE of 240 at CMP then also I will be having max pain if price remains at 245. Anywhere above 245 will be beneficial.
Selling 240 is high risk, hardly any OI and so close.
Then u be stuck making sure it expired above 240 , if stock retraces, u'd be in soup.

I'd rather sell two lots of 230.
IT has 2nd highest OI, but selling puts is risky, and using 2 lots which increases down side risk more but given the OI i'd bet on that.


I was going to suggest you buy a Future at say 243,
and hold it as long as its trading above it.
SL would be 243+overheads.
This has a Delta of 1 so u'd make money any which way.

Da's idea is cooler, bcos u'd need a bit less margin but it also has a delta of 1.

So a 5-10pt gap down etc could hurt u in both the Delta 1 hedge.
 
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rajputz

Well-Known Member
#8
Selling 240 is high risk, hardly any OI and so close.
Then u be stuck making sure it expired above 240 , if stock retraces, u'd be in soup.

I'd rather sell two lots of 230.
IT has 2nd highest OI, but selling puts is risky, and using 2 lots which increases down side risk more but given the OI i'd bet on that.


I was going to suggest you buy a Future at say 243,
and hold it as long as its trading above it.
SL would be 243+overheads.
This has a Delta of 1 so u'd make money any which way.

Da's idea is cooler, bcos u'd need a bit less margin but it also has a delta of 1.

So a 5-10pt gap down etc could hurt u in both the Delta 1 hedge.
I think all depends on how it opens tomorrow.

Initially I had thought off a stoploss at 241. 241 got hit at 3:29. So now tomorrows opening will matter. I will square off if it drags further.

Its only 1 of my 10 trades. Rest are good. But since it happens to all 1 out of 10 trades, I wanted to know if it can be saved or turned around into profit somehow.

Please explain how everybody is seeing it getting more higher. I am not seeing it go more than 241 or 245 max.

1. 245 is huge resistance.
2. Already upmove is more than 30 35%. there has to ver short covering in last few days.
3. OI is max buildup on 240 CE.

So of all the 3 enlighten me where I am wrong and can realign.
 

travi

Well-Known Member
#9
I think all depends on how it opens tomorrow.

Initially I had thought off a stoploss at 241. 241 got hit at 3:29. So now tomorrows opening will matter. I will square off if it drags further.

Its only 1 of my 10 trades. Rest are good. But since it happens to all 1 out of 10 trades, I wanted to know if it can be saved or turned around into profit somehow.

Please explain how everybody is seeing it getting more higher. I am not seeing it go more than 241 or 245 max.

1. 245 is huge resistance.
2. Already upmove is more than 30 35%. there has to ver short covering in last few days.
3. OI is max buildup on 240 CE.

So of all the 3 enlighten me where I am wrong and can realign.
In Trending mkts, the Max OI does sometimes get tested on the weak side.
I have a similar strategy executed in the Path to Consistency thread.

At 21900, I'd sold a strangle 21500P/22100C and today same thing happened.
It had max OI and for most of the day it was around 480.
Anyway 31pts collected were trading at around 25 and when Theta kicked in the afternoon, I exited with 25pt profit.
Ultimately 21500 closed ITM at inr. 9 from original 15.
Imagine BN falling 500pts in 2.5 days :D:D

Around 80pts in short as a hedge was additional gain. Once price threatens your breakeven, open a trend trade and gain something.
 

rajputz

Well-Known Member
#10
In Trending mkts, the Max OI does sometimes get tested on the weak side.
I have a similar strategy executed in the Path to Consistency thread.

At 21900, I'd sold a strangle 21500P/22100C and today same thing happened.
It had max OI and for most of the day, it was around 480.
Anyway, 31pts collected were trading at around 25 and when Theta kicked in the afternoon, I exited with a 25pt profit.
Ultimately 21500 closed ITM at inr. 9 from original 15.
Imagine BN falling 500pts in 2.5 days :D:D

Around 80pts in short as a hedge was additional gain. Once price threatens your breakeven, open a trend trade and gain something.

Well, I got it under control. 241 was my stop loss. And was mentally prepared to exit it at 3 Rs.

But as price dragged lower I thought it better to square off at 2.4. Better than 3 I guess.

But I have thought of a solution. My whole basis of selling is that stock has already soared a lot. Is standing at a resistance. Plus I keep a mental stop and I am in the position on last 5 6 days when decay is highest.

My thinking is that stock cannot keep going up and up and up or down and down or down after such a long movie. Especially near expiry as there has to be covering.

Worst Case Scenario is that it goes against everything I thought, then I had a mental stop and I cannot do anything about it. But otherwise, I can keep a tab on hourly charts. Any shoot out to the upper side is only after little consolidation. Like a channel. If that channel is broke near my stop loss or before my stop loss, that's a sign to exit and probably going long on a future contract. Also in the counter trade on future trade, I am going with already established trend.