Trading or gambling.

#1
I have been pondering over this for quite a long time.

How is trading different from proffessional gambling? The proffessional gambler also knows what to play for..how much is his losing appetite and his returns.

Why this question arose in my mind is because ..gambling is addictive..and so iS trading.
 
#2
I have been pondering over this for quite a long time.

How is trading different from proffessional gambling? The proffessional gambler also knows what to play for..how much is his losing appetite and his returns.

Why this question arose in my mind is because ..gambling is addictive..and so iS trading.
Oh...there is plenty of difference between trading and gambling :

1) Gamblers gamble to satisfy their gambling instinct... traders trade as a business...

2) In gambling house has the edge....in trading trader stacks the odds in his favour...

3) In gambling gambler presses when he is loosing....in trading traders add when he is in a winning position

4) In gambling the gambler looses control on how much he looses,in trading traders have stoplosses,weekly and monthly maximum drawdowns after which they have to halt trading temporarily....

5) Gambler wants to make big on a single large bet,trader goes on making small bets and accumalating profits trade by trade...

6) Gambling is addictive....trading is passionate....I have seen many good traders taking time off and enjoy vacations with their families.....

So cheer up....we are traders...certainly not gamblers....

Best Wishes,

Smart_trade
 
#3
Oh...there is plenty of difference between trading and gambling :

1) Gamblers gamble to satisfy their gambling instinct... traders trade as a business...

2) In gambling house has the edge....in trading trader stacks the odds in his favour...

3) In gambling gambler presses when he is loosing....in trading traders add when he is in a winning position

4) In gambling the gambler looses control on how much he looses,in trading traders have stoplosses,weekly and monthly maximum drawdowns after which they have to halt trading temporarily....

5) Gambler wants to make big on a single large bet,trader goes on making small bets and accumalating profits trade by trade...

6) Gambling is addictive....trading is passionate....I have seen many good traders taking time off and enjoy vacations with their families.....

So cheer up....we are traders...certainly not gamblers....

Best Wishes,

Smart_trade
I was not saying that traders ARE gamblers...i was just comparing the two.

Sorry to sound naive again, but aren't day traders close cousins of gamblers?
Sorry professional gamblers...I mean, they lose so much so fast and yet they come back with double vengeance to hit the market on the very next day? They cant take their eyes off the screen, as if they cant be stopped ( ADDICTED) What would you call those people?

I understand that the rules of the games ( which you have said so many times in this forum and also in reply to my question ) SHOULD NOT change..but they do for day traders... i have yet to meet a calm day traders who was not "betting" ..."yeh stock to upar hi jaayega...dekh lena ..." kind of person.

I have read somewhere that statistically speaking, day traders are the most loosing breed of investors. So that means, house, ( market) has an edge with them...
 

pleaseharsh

Well-Known Member
#4
I was not saying that traders ARE gamblers...i was just comparing the two.

Sorry to sound naive again, but aren't day traders close cousins of gamblers?
Sorry professional gamblers...I mean, they lose so much so fast and yet they come back with double vengeance to hit the market on the very next day? They cant take their eyes off the screen, as if they cant be stopped ( ADDICTED) What would you call those people?

I understand that the rules of the games ( which you have said so many times in this forum and also in reply to my question ) SHOULD NOT change..but they do for day traders... i have yet to meet a calm day traders who was not "betting" ..."yeh stock to upar hi jaayega...dekh lena ..." kind of person.

I have read somewhere that statistically speaking, day traders are the most loosing breed of investors. So that means, house, ( market) has an edge with them...
hello...st has above given u sound reasoning....

first of all.....pls define 'addiction' ????

ok let me do it :

"The term "addiction" is used in many contexts to describe an obsession, compulsion, or excessive psychological dependence, such as: drug addiction (e.g. alcoholism), video game addiction, crime, money, work addiction, compulsive overeating, problem gambling, computer addiction, nicotine addiction, etc." ..... (source)

we have seen ppl working 16-18 hrs a day ......technically they are called workaholics...this is 'addiction' as per psychologist....

All business /profession has got pressure to achieve target & goal....and ppl work hard to achieve it ...but still is success gauranted even after so much hard effort..?.some get success many fail ....why ? there could be many reasons for it....improper method/resource, bias thinking ..etc etc........the same is the case with trading....many fail cuz they come in with wrong attitude to get rich quick...the truth is it requires lot of chart screening.....lot of effort...so is it addiction ? ...

secondly the life itself is gambling....the next moment we will survive is not gauranted...trading is a tough profession ...the odds are high but odds to become a bollywood star or get selected in indian cricket team has thousand times greater odds than becoming a successful trader or gambler.....still millions of aspiring lads spent hrs and hrs striving to become an actor or cricketor..just handful of many many thousand get to top....its the passion that strives a person to achieve though wtever could be the end result...

third....gambling (cards,poker..etc etc) is bad as far as it is played without rules/strategy and positive psychology...........but this applies to all feilds of profession.....professional gamblers play by their own strategy...its a successful profession for many.....like any other profession they survive and earn their living by gambling....it requires extreme skills to achieve that level...many of them dont poses it and so r doomed to get failed....
gambling /trading are as passionate profession as any other...

neways enough said..i hope i m able to convince you.....:thumb:
 

pleaseharsh

Well-Known Member
#5
I understand that the rules of the games ( which you have said so many times in this forum and also in reply to my question ) SHOULD NOT change..but they do for day traders... i have yet to meet a calm day traders who was not "betting" ..."yeh stock to upar hi jaayega...dekh lena ..." kind of person.
:)
those traders whom u r talking abt r playing more by luck & pray...so we will not see them calm ..its natural...

I have read somewhere that statistically speaking, day traders are the most loosing breed of investors. So that means, house, ( market) has an edge with them...

"day traders are the most loosing breed of investors" :confused:

traders and investors belong to two different profession...traders are not subset of investors.....so it cannot be its breed.....trading is purely based on technical stuff whereas investing is based more on fundamentals..(thats a different thing some investor follows basic charts to take investing decision...)
yeah we can say that day trading, swing trading..etc are breed(style) of TRADING...

regarding house having edge....it could be....
 
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#6
I have been pondering over this for quite a long time.

How is trading different from proffessional gambling? The proffessional gambler also knows what to play for..how much is his losing appetite and his returns.

Why this question arose in my mind is because ..gambling is addictive..and so iS trading.
Gambling is staking everything for enormous returns, if the bet goes against the expectation, then the person is left with nothing...

I have 1, I want 2 or more, if 1 (i staked) goes away, i am left with 0 (zero) = gamble.

Trading is earning some or enormous returns, without putting everything at stake. even if the attempt (not bet here) fails, the person does not go bankrupt or broke. He still can survive without being in debt.

I have 1, i want more than 1, if 1 (i staked) is reduced to 0.5, i am still left with 0.5 to survive.

Trading in margin/F&O (leveraged entities) can be seen as gambling. If we go into debt after a loss then it is definitely gambling.

My definition of gambling is this:
if we go broke or fall in debt trap because of a failed attempt then it is gambling.
 

nifty

Active Member
#7
Oh...there is plenty of difference between trading and gambling :

1) Gamblers gamble to satisfy their gambling instinct... traders trade as a business...

2) In gambling house has the edge....in trading trader stacks the odds in his favour...

3) In gambling gambler presses when he is loosing....in trading traders add when he is in a winning position

4) In gambling the gambler looses control on how much he looses,in trading traders have stoplosses,weekly and monthly maximum drawdowns after which they have to halt trading temporarily....

5) Gambler wants to make big on a single large bet,trader goes on making small bets and accumalating profits trade by trade...

6) Gambling is addictive....trading is passionate....I have seen many good traders taking time off and enjoy vacations with their families.....

So cheer up....we are traders...certainly not gamblers....

Best Wishes,

Smart_trade
I agree with you :)
 
#8
:)
those traders whom u r talking abt r playing more by luck & pray...so we will not see them calm ..its natural...




"day traders are the most loosing breed of investors" :confused:

traders and investors belong to two different profession...traders are not subset of investors.....so it cannot be its breed.....trading is purely based on technical stuff whereas investing is based more on fundamentals..(thats a different thing some investor follows basic charts to take investing decision...)
yeah we can say that day trading, swing trading..etc are breed(style) of TRADING...

regarding house having edge....it could be....

Hold on..!

You are saying that traders and investors are two different people?

I believe whoever is putting his money on the line following any logic is an investor, Because he is "investing" his "money" and "time" in to the idea...so ..anyone who puts in his money in any idea..is an investor.

I didn't mean to upset any day trader here, i was just wanted to put across a fact which i came across some time ago. Why it is that the losing breed of traders are day traders?
 
#9
One cannot make a general statement about trading success and failure....all day traders are not successful and all daytraders are not failures either....as all investors are not successful but all investors are not failures....

Daytrading has a low success rate because of the following :

1) It attracts people with the false notion that this is a great way of making money without any work....they make poor trades and loose money

2) Error tolerence is low in daytrading because of limited time period....so one has to be right more often....

3) Reward to risk ratio is not very large in daytrading as compared to swing or position trading....

4) Less time for thinking and analysing ...so the daytraders actions should be quick and well practiced....

There is no point advocating a particular style of trading/investing...it all depends on indivisual frame of mind....it is best to know what kind of trading/investing style/timeframe one is comfortable with and be a professional in that style......

Best wishes ....Trade well !!!

Smart_trade
 

priyanvada

Well-Known Member
#10
Vipin Sir,

AS per my understanding both games are so beautiful on their own!...may differenciate due to their inbuilt rules like method of play, risk to reward ratio etc. etc.

Anyway my point is "It is the question "how" the game is being played by the player,will decide the "activity" as trading or gambling"...

... If the action is taken by the player just out of emotion then it is a perfectly 100% gamble,...Normallly emtions are caused just out of embedded programs in our brain ... but some emotions are intuitions ...they ARE destined to be true(my belief!)... the player who has ability to successfully differenciate between emotion and intuitions, will plays only on intution and so will always win...and should be called as "The greatest gambler!" ...

... So now when probability and statistics and logic and relevant information starts taking part in making a decisions in the game, then it becomes more like a ""trading business" ... The more you are informed,the more intelligently you play the game, the more probable winner you are!!... So where knowledge and information makes decision then we should call it as trading!

For humans like us no action happens solely on all the knowledge ... Action may happen sometimes solely on emotion since it takes no hardwork for that ... So as a result we observe a mixture of gambling and trading in any game we play ... Beginners like me play more like a gambler and Veterans play more like a trader ... :)

regards,
priyanvada
 
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