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Is this cheating?

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  #31  
Old 25th November 2007, 07:03 PM
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Default Re: Is this cheating?

Good that problem is solved. BTW - Esignal also misses data !!
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  #32  
Old 25th November 2007, 08:37 PM
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Default Re: Is this cheating?

Quote:
Originally Posted by aroymkp View Post
Good that problem is solved. BTW - Esignal also misses data !!
NO.The problem is still there.This time NSE is the acuused party.

Yes,it is evident that when the Indian no.1 data vendor can't fetch data accurately,then the outsider esignal will also miss data,as the root problem is there in the technology used by NSE....
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  #33  
Old 25th November 2007, 10:35 PM
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Default Re: Is this cheating?

Quote:
Originally Posted by hari09omkar View Post
NO.The problem is still there.This time NSE is the acuused party.

Yes,it is evident that when the Indian no.1 data vendor can't fetch data accurately,then the outsider esignal will also miss data,as the root problem is there in the technology used by NSE....
btw, who is this India's no. 1 data vendor?

Thanks
nb
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  #34  
Old 25th November 2007, 10:43 PM
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Default Re: Is this cheating?

do the trade verification. then dig into the problem if its genuine
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  #35  
Old 25th November 2007, 10:44 PM
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Default Re: Is this cheating?

Quote:
Originally Posted by newbee View Post
btw, who is this India's no. 1 data vendor?

Thanks
nb
Spidersoftwareindia and Falcon are close competitors with the earlier having much much edge.
P.S. I don't think these multimillionaire companies need advertisement from a poor guy like me.....but still for the stature Traderji has maintained for itself,I should mention that this is not an endorsement for them,neither I am satisfied with their service fully,till today.
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  #36  
Old 26th November 2007, 03:44 AM
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Default Re: Is this cheating?

Hari,

Now do you know why day trading does not work? The indicators just cannot be accurately formed on tick/minute data. The fault is not with NSE. The problem exists the world over (even the US). In fact its not a problem at all. Refer to trading books of any foriegn author and they will talk about whipsaws.

Have you ever plotted a graph? Graphs are plotted on time scale. i.e. the price "at that moment" for fixed intervals of time like n, n +1, n + 2, n + 3, so on. How can you expect a chart for every trade? Thats impossible. How can you plot a graph with 0.01 second time scale? and even if we could, are we super humans to trade on a 0.01 second time frame?

Please dont blame others for your trading faults. Your stops are too tight, secondly you are day trading. Your stops will be hit many times. Its not the systems fault.
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  #37  
Old 26th November 2007, 09:52 AM
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Default Re: Is this cheating?

Quote:
Originally Posted by supaTrade View Post
Have you ever plotted a graph? Graphs are plotted on time scale. i.e. the price "at that moment" for fixed intervals of time like n, n +1, n + 2, n + 3, so on. How can you expect a chart for every trade? Thats impossible. How can you plot a graph with 0.01 second time scale? and even if we could, are we super humans to trade on a 0.01 second time frame?
graph are ploted on time scale but not the data. and graphs are nothing but a graphical representation of the data. with tick data it is possible to plot every details, provided the charting software allows us to do so.

cheers,
jdm.
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  #38  
Old 26th November 2007, 10:02 AM
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Default Re: Is this cheating?

Quote:
Originally Posted by supaTrade View Post
Hari,

Now do you know why day trading does not work? The indicators just cannot be accurately formed on tick/minute data.
Ohhhhhhh.Sorry Sir,it seems u r a greek to successfull day trading.Where from u got dat indicators can't b formed with a winning percentage for tick/minute data? Wherever it might b,it is 100% wrong.
Quote:
Originally Posted by supaTrade View Post
The fault is not with NSE. The problem exists the world over (even the US). In fact its not a problem at all. Refer to trading books of any foriegn author and they will talk about whipsaws.
Yes,now I refer to the trading books of foreign authors only,as d Desi writers r worthless.Whipsaw has nothing to do with what u r referring to.Whipsaw is termed for ne trade hitting stops and going back in the direction u wanted it to go....it may b in day trading,in weekly and monthly position trading.It is not something that is related to day trading with short time frame.
Quote:
Originally Posted by supaTrade View Post
Have you ever plotted a graph? ..... How can you expect a chart for every trade? Thats impossible. How can you plot a graph with 0.01 second time scale? and even if we could, are we super humans to trade on a 0.01 second time frame?
Yes,many times,being a science student,I had to plot graphs.
I am expecting a chart for every trade because for getting this I am paying to the authority concerned.
Now,the question is how to plot a graph with 0.01 sec. time scale.Sir,kindly go back to the theory of 'limit'. U will get that the function's value can tend to zero ,like 0.1,0.01,0.001,0.0001....in all dese cases the value of the function is going to reach the zero,but it never meets.This is the basics of the differential calculus from which Newton originated the theory of calculus.Now if we can get derivatives of ne function,by differentiate it,we r simply assuming that the denominator is minimized to that extent,where it is 'tending' to zero.Here our denominator being time,and n being a number which is tending to zero,but not zero,like 0.0001,the value of n+1 is traceable in the X scale of our graph paper.So the price will also be traceable,in the Y scale if it exists in that time interval.So the point of plotting a graph at 0.01 second time scale is easily solved when the softwares and the system are made competent enough to plot the X scale of the graph paper with the n at 0.001 seconds,or whatever small time frame,which is less than the shortest time needed to occur a trade(which u say 0.01 sec.)

For trading successfully,in ne time frame,we need knowledge and competence to make a system which is winning.No superhuman is needed to trade a tick chart.A dumb also can do that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by supaTrade View Post
Please dont blame others for your trading faults. Your stops are too tight, secondly you are day trading. Your stops will be hit many times. Its not the systems fault.
Stops can b tight,as low as 0.5 %,even shorter.And can be won 5% or more in a single trade.The day I referred to u of HCC trade missing data,I took two other trades,from one of which more dan 4 times profit was made,against d loss incurred in HCC.It is a day to day business for me Sir.I know that day trading doesn't mean hitting the stops frequently.....That is nothing to do with a miss of data.

Last edited by hari09omkar; 26th November 2007 at 10:10 AM.
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  #39  
Old 26th November 2007, 10:29 AM
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Default Re: Is this cheating?

Quote:
Originally Posted by supaTrade View Post
Friends,

You need to understand the trade execution and data transmission mechanism. Please understand that the data is for "transmission" to broker has a gap of atleast 1-4 seconds. You can zoom in to NSE charts for that (gap of 4 seconds). Hence the trades happening between those times are not recorded in the charts. A trade can happen at 0.8 pico seconds and nobody will even know.

Eg. if a stock is at Rs 100, I see that 100 shares are available at my desired price of 100.05 and I put a market order for 100 shares. What happens is that another buyer may similiarly put a market order. Secondly the quantity displayed is not the actual size. It may be one tenth of the actual size (we have facility to reduce exposed quantity remember? i.e. actual size may be 1000). Hence order of both the buyers will get executed at real time and the price may go to 100.20 and come back to 100.05 due to momentary selling pressure and exposure. All this happens within 0.01 seconds.
However the data transmission interval is 0.5 seconds. Hence the transactions will not be visble on charts but will have been executed at price of 100.20.

These are called whipsaws. Is a whip visible before it hits you?

Have you observed the best 5 bid/ask data for sometime? You can clearly see this happening. The "quantity available" for bid/ask changes above and below the current market price (observe carefully) due to the reason mentioned above.

Please do not blame brokers for everything! Hari, changing brokers/data providers will not affect the execution. Your stop would have been hit even if you placed the order with some other broker. You are placing very tight stops, these are prone to whipsaws specially during these volatile market situations.

A broker will not risk his license and 2 crore deposit for gaining Rs. 1.5 from you. Hope this helps clear your doubt. Learn the art of placing stops.
fully agree with you.
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  #40  
Old 26th November 2007, 02:15 PM
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Default Re: Is this cheating?

I am sorry if I appear blunt, but being arrogant will not help you. I never said that a 0.01 second chart cannot be plotted. Even a 0.000001 second chart can be plotted, but whats the use? Data is not transmitted for less than 0.5 secs even in the US. Also please read carefully, I said indicators cannot be "accurately" formed on tick data not that they cant be formed at all.

Whipsaws exist in every time frame but they occur in very small time frames in day trading as happend in your case.

I am not a newbie and have been trading in cash and futures sucessfully for the last 10 years. I have traded many trading systems (including techniques for day trading).

BTW what is your age? you seem to be very young.

Last edited by supaTrade; 26th November 2007 at 02:28 PM.
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